With all your talk of needing to move on for Seabrook for the better of the team, it's hard to tell that you don't mean now. How would anyone know you're talking about the past when all you keep talking about is the future lol? And yes, we do know it would hurt their chances, unless as I said before, the return was for a player of similar value to the team. But how many teams are trading top 2/4 guys like that right now?

I'm not kidding myself about the Pens. They had subpar shot attempt share, scoring chances were low, and a suspect defense (Dumoulin was their #1, Hainsey was their #2 ffs) - they visibly looked terrible large chucks of the year and playoffs. But their goalies carried them through the difficult series, they score opportune goals, and they met up with a hurt / tired team in the final. They were pretty good in 2016, they just didn't perform as well in 2017. Not that it matters cause they won it all both time but it shows that in a cap league, teams can have areas of weakness and still contend / win.
- L_B_R

With all the fancy stats, the Pens ability to forecheck, cycle and pressure outlet passes were outstanding in the playoffs, outstanding. The other team that was outstanding at this was the Preds, and low and behold both teams made it to the finals.

Perfect example is the Leafs, if you look at their forward lines and the speed and size they are building there its quite impressive. They were an extremely tough out in the playoffs, i believe 5 out of 6 of those games went to OT. Their defenseman are average at best.

For that matter, Kempny can blast it from the left side too. The thing I think they're missing (and have been since 2011 when they traded the REAL Campbell away) is a guy who can "QB" the power play from back there.
- John Jaeckel

I wonder if Rutta can step into that role sometime in the future as he continues his transition?

With all the fancy stats, the Pens ability to forecheck, cycle and pressure outlet passes were outstanding in the playoffs, outstanding. The other team that was outstanding at this was the Preds, and low and behold both teams made it to the finals.
- BetweenTheDots

I'm not saying they were a terrible team - I'm saying they weren't so good they should have won. Pens lacked both timed and shot metric possession - they spent less time than their opponents in their offensive zone, they touched the puck less, and had less shots/scoring chances/etc in every series except against the Sens. But they did score more off the rush more than almost any other team (Leafs had more per 60 and per game) because their d-men were good at transitioning, they had a great powerplay, and had a .931 sv% at 5v5. The fact that Fleury was a wall in the Caps series in the only reason they got to the next round - Cap absolutely owned them in every category, including micro-stats like passing, zone entries, puck battles.

So I think my assessment was pretty accurate - a flawed team that scored opportune goals and had great goalies. Adding: Tbf it's possible that if their goalies hadn't been playing as well as they were, the rest of the team would protected them more / been better defensively but it wasn't needed. I feel like this was how the 2015 Hawks team was in some regards - teams sometimes play loose in front of great goalies.

With all your talk of needing to move on for Seabrook for the better of the team, it's hard to tell that you don't mean now. How would anyone know you're talking about the past when all you keep talking about is the future lol? And yes, we do know it would hurt their chances, unless as I said before, the return was for a player of similar value to the team. But how many teams are trading top 2/4 guys like that right now?

I'm not kidding myself about the Pens. They had subpar shot attempt share, scoring chances were low, and a suspect defense (Dumoulin was their #1, Hainsey was their #2 ffs) - they visibly looked terrible large chucks of the year and playoffs. But their goalies carried them through the difficult series, they score opportune goals, and they met up with a hurt / tired team in the final. They were pretty good in 2016, they just didn't perform as well in 2017. Not that it matters cause they won it all both time but it shows that in a cap league, teams can have areas of weakness and still contend / win.
- L_B_R

Can it happen? Sure, but this is the exception to the rule. In reality chances are very high that say 9 of the next 10 SC Champs will post impressive advanced metrics during their playoff run and not have to be bailed out by PDO. So I wouldn't bet on this years Hawks team being able to eek their way through the playoffs with a subpar Dcore getting heavily outshot every night like the Penguins did last year.

I don't remember Darling attacking the puck in Chicago as much as he's doing in Carolina.

Has he always come well out of his net to challenge shooters, especially on rebounds? seems like when he gives a rebound up he throws the bulk of himself at the puck/shooter.

Can it happen? Sure, but this is the exception to the rule. In reality chances are very high that say 9 of the next 10 SC Champs will post impressive advanced metrics during their playoff run and not have to be bailed out by PDO. So I wouldn't bet on this years Hawks team being able to eek their way through the playoffs with a supbar Dcore like the Penguins did last year.
- SimpleJack

My actual point, which I deviated from a little so I get the confusion, was actually that they need to keep Seabrook now because removing him for anything less than someone of his value would weaken the d-core too much. I don't want the d-core to be like the Pens last year, though if the 'slack' (for lack of a better word) was picked up by the goalie/forwards it wouldn't be the end of the world. I only mentioned the Pens offhand because probability-wise anything is possible in hockey as long as something is clicking (system, goalie, stars), even if the odds are low.

Mostly I was defending Seabrook, who has been playing well. Not like Seabrook at 28, but still top 4.

I don't remember Darling attacking the puck in Chicago as much as he's doing in Carolina.

Has he always come well out of his net to challenge shooters, especially on rebounds? seems like when he gives a rebound up he throws the bulk of himself at the puck/shooter.
- BINGO!

I think I remember him using his huge body on a few occasions.

I don't remember Darling attacking the puck in Chicago as much as he's doing in Carolina.

Has he always come well out of his net to challenge shooters, especially on rebounds? seems like when he gives a rebound up he throws the bulk of himself at the puck/shooter.
- BINGO!

I remember wanting to tie him to the goal posts with bungee cords on more than one occasion. Not as bad as Raanta.

I remember wanting to tie him to the goal posts with bungee cords on more than one occasion. Not as bad as Raanta.
- L_B_R

Had the exact same thought. Gonna have to tether the giant because he wanders a LOT.

Coaches are encouraging him to get out and play the puck a lot more than he did in Chicago, which is interesting but risky. He's not the smoothest guy on skates by any stretch.

I wonder if Rutta can step into that role sometime in the future as he continues his transition?
- walleyeb1

Interesting point here...and JJ makes the initial one - that the Hawks since they traded Soupy in 2011 have missed the QB back there on the PP...the question is where to find one or does one of the kids develop into that player. Meanwhile the stagnant Hawks PP continues to not work any magic.

Seabs will be here for a while and he's been a heck of a player here...yes long term ramifications with cap hit and another overpay by Bowman, but we should be used to that by now.

I said before the season began the Hawks will need another forward and another dman to make a run. It's still way too early. This team needs to find out who it is.
Offense - big concern is that unless we have Schmaltz - we're a one line team or so it looks.
Defense - overplaying 2 and 7 too much during the regular season. Love what Rutta has brought so far, but all the young guys need to have more minutes and game experience as it were. Tough to balance when you're trying to bank points.

I agree Seebs is far from a problem .This board always seems to need a whipping boy ,it started with AA now Seebs or Franson .

I still think it's crazy that Jack Johnson didn't at least get a call for his head hunting on Schmaltz

My actual point, which I deviated from a little so I get the confusion, was actually that they need to keep Seabrook now because removing him for anything less than someone of his value would weaken the d-core too much. I don't want the d-core to be like the Pens last year, though if the 'slack' (for lack of a better word) was picked up by the goalie/forwards it wouldn't be the end of the world. I only mentioned the Pens offhand because probability-wise anything is possible in hockey as long as something is clicking (system, goalie, stars), even if the odds are low.

Mostly I was defending Seabrook, who has been playing well. Not like Seabrook at 28, but still top 4.
- L_B_R

I gotcha, I would just say that the odds are REALLY against us simply because the Pens just accomplished that feat(wining the Cup despite poor advanced metrics), and the chances of it happening 2 years in a row with 2 different teams has to be slim to none. But you know this. And its okay to hope.

I agree Seebs is far from a problem .This board always seems to need a whipping boy ,it started with AA now Seebs or Franson .
- oldduffman

Nah.....Seabs is definitely part of the problem(not the entire problem, but deserves blame for his regression and how much $ he's making). "the problem" IMO is our defense. He's one of our defenseman, and his play has slipped, so the whipping is justified IMO. But only to a certain point. Those claiming he's completely done and useless are going too far. But most posters that i see are just saying he's no longer a #2D and not worth the $ he's getting paid.

I still think it's crazy that Jack Johnson didn't at least get a call for his head hunting on Schmaltz
- kinigitt

C'mon man I know what you are saying. But it's best to move on can't undue what's been done. NHL Officiating gives me Gas Pains!

How about - we're mixing two issues here.

One is Seabrooks ability today (and for another season or two) - he's probably a legitimate top 4 through then - and, at a cap hit of $6.875MM per, is probably appropriately paid. I know there are a couple here who think he IS Roszival today - but I don't see it.

But - his contract (at that $6.875) goes for another 6 seasons after this one, with 4 more years of an attached NMC.

So - IMO - for today - we're fine; for the years in the last half of his deal, perhaps not so fine - with the ability to get out of the contract (by deal or by CBA buy-out) being questionable.

Assuming the CBA is reopened after next year, it's impossible to tell how negotiations will go in a revenue-stagnant environment that the NHL finds itself in - will the 50/50 split remain, leading to a stagnant cap - will the players' share decrease, leading to declining caps - will the players' share increase - will there be compliance buy-outs....

Live for today, boys - we have no idea what cap issues will exist in two years - accept a still-quality Seabrook for his play today and don't worry about his contract in 2022.
- StLBravesFan

Yep, well said....... Nice blog, JJ. 3 cups, guy never relied on skating per say, indeed had to babysit the last 2 yrs and now is reunited with Kieth.

I'm not saying they were a terrible team - I'm saying they weren't so good they should have won. Pens lacked both timed and shot metric possession - they spent less time than their opponents in their offensive zone, they touched the puck less, and had less shots/scoring chances/etc in every series except against the Sens. But they did score more off the rush more than almost any other team (Leafs had more per 60 and per game) because their d-men were good at transitioning, they had a great powerplay, and had a .931 sv% at 5v5. The fact that Fleury was a wall in the Caps series in the only reason they got to the next round - Cap absolutely owned them in every category, including micro-stats like passing, zone entries, puck battles.

So I think my assessment was pretty accurate - a flawed team that scored opportune goals and had great goalies. Adding: Tbf it's possible that if their goalies hadn't been playing as well as they were, the rest of the team would protected them more / been better defensively but it wasn't needed. I feel like this was how the 2015 Hawks team was in some regards - teams sometimes play loose in front of great goalies.
- L_B_R

So there is a place you can get actual timed possession of teams in the offensive zone with the puck, instead of the formula of shots on goal bla bla bla

Did you say Seabrook has been fine?

WOW just WOW!

Did you say Seabrook has been fine?

WOW just WOW!
- Goalie-33

This is for JRoenick97 the CLUELESS one.

Nah.....Seabs is definitely part of the problem(not the entire problem, but deserves blame for his regression and how much $ he's making). "the problem" IMO is our defense. He's one of our defenseman, and his play has slipped, so the whipping is justified IMO. But only to a certain point. Those claiming he's completely done and useless are going too far. But most posters that i see are just saying he's no longer a #2D and not worth the $ he's getting paid.
- SimpleJack

Seebs is paid for what he accomplished for this team , and that was a whole lot IMO .Without Seebs at times HAWKS may not have any Cups . As for slipping that is to be expected , but not to the extreme some on here think . My whipping boy would be coach Q ,his stale game planning and personnel decisions are holding this club back . Hey thought we are 4 11 and we are getting Schmaltz back soon I hope ,when he returns we shall see some change I hope ..

So there is a place you can get actual timed possession of teams in the offensive zone with the puck, instead of the formula of shots on goal bla bla bla
- BetweenTheDots

Yes, but you have to pay for the data from companies unless they tweet it out. And timed possession does not correlate as directly to wins.

I gotcha, I would just say that the odds are REALLY against us simply because the Pens just accomplished that feat(wining the Cup despite poor advanced metrics), and the chances of it happening 2 years in a row with 2 different teams has to be slim to none. But you know this. And its okay to hope.
- SimpleJack

It's really a moot point though because it doesn't apply the Hawks yet. Its been 6 games, which - and stop me if you guys have heard this - is too small a sample size to see trends. Hell, even if the first half of a season is bad, a team who does well on the back half can do well (Pens 2009, Bruins 2011).

This is for JRoenick97 the CLUELESS one.
- Goalie-33

Enjoy your timeout - hope they change your diaper and find your binkie

It's really a moot point though because it doesn't apply the Hawks yet. Its been 6 games, which - and stop me if you guys have heard this - is too small a sample size to see trends. Hell, even if the first half of a season is bad, a team who does well on the back half can do well (Pens 2009, Bruins 2011).
- L_B_R

But it gets more complicated when you look at it like this:

The things we've seen in these first 6 games that have been worrisome(not that there haven't been plenty of good things too, but for the sake of this debate...) are the same things we've seen surface more and more over the past 2 seasons, thus the trend can technically be considered much longer than 6 games, with a much larger body of evidence to take into account. These things include our decline in puck possession and other advanced metrics, the decline of our Dcore as a whole, and the decline of Seabrook (and Keith to a lesser extent) individually. So...idk what I'm trying to say exactly, other than I'm somewhat worried and hope we improve. And I think we can and will improve those things when we A. Get Schmaltz back and gain chemistry with a 4 line rotation and B. At some point this season make a move using our cap space to add a defenseman and upgrade the blueline.