Lefty, peak oil consumption is projected to be within the next 10-15 years and then face a steady decline.

Whereas we don't want Alberta to quit producing oil I think now is the time to diversify, even within the oil industry. If you aren't leading change then you're usually caught off guard by it.

Lefty, peak oil consumption is projected to be within the next 10-15 years and then face a steady decline.

Whereas we don't want Alberta to quit producing oil I think now is the time to diversify, even within the oil industry. If you aren't leading change then you're usually caught off guard by it.
- golfingsince

I’m between a rock and a hard place with it, having just retired after 30 years as a professional engineer I’ve somewhat disengaged from the business side of it. But I do love a good civil, intelligent, discussion on our country, especially the industry I know best.

So many things are made from oil that society in general needs, alternatives just aren’t there on a large affordable scale.

Personally I see no end in the consumption because it’s not the G7 countries who are consuming the most, it’s developing countries who don’t have the means for alternatives and huge countries with massive poor populations who use petrol on a massive scale.

China, India, USA, Japan and Russia are responsible for 65% of the worlds carbon emissions. You think they’re gonna change their ways within the next 50 years? I don’t. That being said, China is leading the way in developing alternatives, however, having worked in remote China, there’s zero chance 90% of their population could benefit from that.

Everyone talks about diversifying but no one has any answers, they just like saying those words.

I agree with it all and that's why I used the term "wean". Slowly remove the dependence and replace with alternatives. I never said to just shut if off.

Here's my reasoning. We know that energy trends are going to electric. Who benefits most from an electric economy? Governments, both federal and provincial, because most electric companies are Crown or Provincial Corporations. Oil and gas industry are mostly privately held with a majority of the profits going to the head company (usually foreign).

Now the question is; how will all this electricity needed be made? With Canada agreeing to all these environmental and climate accords, we will not be able to generate electricity using fossil fuels. There will be pressure on industry to research and develop alternatives to fuels. Therefore the need for fossil fuel will decrease naturally by shear lack of demand.

It won't happen tomorrow or the next day, but if Alberta continues to go all-in on oil production now for the quick buck, then they will pay in the future big time. Look at fisheries out east. Look at the automotive industry in Ontario. Dying slow deaths while they keep trying to prop it up. Alberta's next.
- bloatedmosquito

No disrespect Bloated, but you’re talking about a nation of 36 million people, we could shutdown our resource industry tomorrow and it wouldn’t affect the world one bit. Canada is nothing compared to the actual problem countries.

When the world finds out Saudi’s reserves are not what they say they are, oil will skyrocket.

Canada is uniquely positioned to provide an abundance of reliable, safe, and secure energy. Oil and natural gas resource development, which includes oil sands, natural gas, and conventional and unconventional oil, is active across Canada and uses goods and services from many regions across the country.

Canada’s proven recoverable oil reserves total more than 170 billion barrels, of which 165 billion barrels (or 96 per cent) can be recovered from the oil sands using today's technology. Canada has the world’s third-largest oil reserves, after Venezuela and Saudi Arabia. Canada is the world’s fifth-largest producer of natural gas, with an estimated 1,225 trillion cubic feet (Tcf) of remaining natural gas resources. That’s more than enough natural gas to for at least 300 years, given current domestic consumption.

With all due respect, our resource industry is nothing like the automotive or fishing industry. There’s enough demand and proven/unproven reserves to last hundreds of years. Affordable proven alternatives on a massive scale, to this point, are just not there.

And not to mention, since year 2000 Canadian GHG emissions per barrel produced have reduced 28%, we are continually producing cleaner and cleaner energy.

They have half the culture.
- Marwood

No disrespect Bloated, but you’re talking about a nation of 36 million people, we could shutdown our resource industry tomorrow and it wouldn’t affect the world one bit. Canada is nothing compared to the actual problem countries.

When the world finds out Saudi’s reserves are not what they say they are, oil will skyrocket.

Canada is uniquely positioned to provide an abundance of reliable, safe, and secure energy. Oil and natural gas resource development, which includes oil sands, natural gas, and conventional and unconventional oil, is active across Canada and uses goods and services from many regions across the country.

Canada’s proven recoverable oil reserves total more than 170 billion barrels, of which 165 billion barrels (or 96 per cent) can be recovered from the oil sands using today's technology. Canada has the world’s third-largest oil reserves, after Venezuela and Saudi Arabia. Canada is the world’s fifth-largest producer of natural gas, with an estimated 1,225 trillion cubic feet (Tcf) of remaining natural gas resources. That’s more than enough natural gas to for at least 300 years, given current domestic consumption.

With all due respect, our resource industry is nothing like the automotive or fishing industry. There’s enough demand and proven/unproven reserves to last hundreds of years. Affordable proven alternatives on a massive scale, to this point, are just not there.

And not to mention, since year 2000 Canadian GHG emissions per barrel produced have reduced 28%, we are continually producing cleaner and cleaner energy.
- Pacificgem

It's not clean enough for the marine industry.

It's not clean enough for the marine industry.
- golfingsince

Are you referring to the shipping of bitumen? The marine industry has absolutely no issues with transporting the product.

If you are talking about emissions from vessels, that is also being modified as new technologies and practices become available.

It's not clean enough for the marine industry.
- golfingsince

In what sense? Producing it from offshore facilities. Burning it in marine engines? Transporting it? Did you know around 160K barrels, 5 million US gallons, of oil seeps into our oceans naturally on an annual basis?

Look guys, i've only done a bit of light reading on the subject. However, the sour bitumens from western Canada apparently don't meet the standard. I'm not up to par on the science behind it. Here's a quick link for the standards and their effects. 2020 is two months away.

https://business.financia...or-oilsands-crude-in-2020

Look guys, i've only done a bit of light reading on the subject. However, the sour bitumens from western Canada apparently don't meet the standard. I'm not up to par on the science behind it. Here's a quick link for the standards and their effects. 2020 is two months away.

https://business.financia...or-oilsands-crude-in-2020
- golfingsince

We hardly ship any bitumen by sea as there’s no pipeline space or shipping facilities to do so? 95% of it is shipped to the United States via pipeline.

Most of the big oilsand producers production feeds upgraders, which removes sulphur and other impurity’s. As far as burning bunker fuel (a byproduct of the refining process) in ships, you’re God damned right shipping companies around the world should be using cleaner burning fuel. Everything’s profit driver and things like bunker fuel, elemental sulphur and coke are almost now considered waste products. They’re cheap to buy but they’re very dirty to burn.

We hardly ship any bitumen by sea as there’s no pipeline space or shipping facilities to do so? 95% of it is shipped to the United States via pipeline.

Most of the big oilsand producers production feeds upgraders, which removes sulphur and other impurity’s. As far as burning bunker fuel in ships, you’re God damned right shipping companies around the world should be using cleaner burning fuel. Everything’s profit driver and things like bunker fuel, elemental sulphur and coke are almost now considered waste products. They’re cheap to buy but they’re very dirty to burn.
- Pacificgem

OK, so we're already starting to see a shift. IF the oil quality is an issue, what's the rush on the pipeline ( which does pose environmental risk ) since the whole idea is to ship it.

Here's an alternative idea.

https://business.financia...build-bitumen-pucks-plant

I really have little personal stakes in this, aside from my employee share program. I've also read that they can use the old coal ports to ship it. As an aside, Alberta could import plastic from the rest of Canada. It sure beats sending back empty cars.

Look guys, i've only done a bit of light reading on the subject. However, the sour bitumens from western Canada apparently don't meet the standard. I'm not up to par on the science behind it. Here's a quick link for the standards and their effects. 2020 is two months away.

https://business.financia...or-oilsands-crude-in-2020
- golfingsince

Canada is definitely a signatory with IMO, and although I haven't read the IMO resolution, but I am extremely knowledgeable with mitigating the dangers or concerns associated with deep sea shipping, including vessels in and out of Kinder Morgans Facilities.

The marine pilots, the port, the government, to the extent of Industry Canada and judicial approvals all are preparing for the probability of this project going ahead.

Have you read this article, I thought this is a pretty innovative solution, https://www.cbc.ca/news/b...cn-rail-canapux-1.4982153,
https://globalnews.ca/new...ds-transportation-canada/.

Now this certainly isn't an endorsement that these are the solutions to move the product, but it is more to make the point that technologies and industry are looking to find solutions that meet international requirements, environmentalist concerns (which will never ever happen) and new federal and provincial regulatory processes.

OK, so we're already starting to see a shift. IF the oil quality is an issue, what's the rush on the pipeline ( which does pose environmental risk ) since the whole idea is to ship it.

Here's an alternative idea.

https://business.financia...build-bitumen-pucks-plant

I really have little personal stakes in this, aside from my employee share program. I've also read that they can use the old coal ports to ship it. As an aside, Alberta could import plastic from the rest of Canada. It sure beats sending back empty cars.
- golfingsince

What I get from the article you linked is the burning of high sulphur fuels in ships, not actually shipping it, if I’m reading it correctly? It kind of blends two separate issues into one, which is nonsense. You don’t burn raw bitumen in internal combustion engines.

People probably don’t understand that there’s several different types of oil produced in the oilsands industry. Raw bitumen is oil where the sand has simply been removed from it by an expensive, yet still profitable, process call froth treatment.

If your deposits are 50 meters and below you use SAGD (steam assisted gravity drainage), a process where you inject steam into the ground deposit to reduce the viscosity of the oil and you pump it to the surface with an ESP (electric submersible pump). There’s no sand involved, just tons of water that’s from the steam which has collapsed subsurface. This is Western Canadian Select oil.

There’s also synthetic crude oil, which is oil produced from upgraders, those upgraders are fed by raw bitumen. They produce extremely clean oil, companies pay and absolute premium to purchase it because it’s so clean. All the major companies have one, Shell, Syncrude, Suncor, CNRL, Husky Energy, etc. Smaller producers don’t. They dilute it with something called diluent and ship it via pipeline to companies that have upgraders or to Enbridge in Edmonton for distribution to multiple end users.

In 2018 over one million barrels of SCO is produced daily in Alberta for refineries.

Canada is definitely a signatory with IMO, and although I haven't read the IMO resolution, but I am extremely knowledgeable with mitigating the dangers or concerns associated with deep sea shipping, including vessels in and out of Kinder Morgans Facilities.

The marine pilots, the port, the government, to the extent of Industry Canada and judicial approvals all are preparing for the probability of this project going ahead.

Have you read this article, I thought this is a pretty innovative solution, https://www.cbc.ca/news/b...cn-rail-canapux-1.4982153,
https://globalnews.ca/new...ds-transportation-canada/.

Now this certainly isn't an endorsement that these are the solutions to move the product, but it is more to make the point that technologies and industry are looking to find solutions that meet international requirements, environmentalist concerns (which will never ever happen) and new federal and provincial regulatory processes.
- Makita

I agree with you though, it's innovative ideas to safely move the product at a reduced cost without the inherent risk. Draw from the past, live in the now, look to the future.

Alberta has some innovation going on, they and we should be focusing on that instead catering to the needs of the big five. That's how you get ahead. It's not much different than being able to extract from the oil sands. You have to just keep finding better ways of doing things.

The Alberta budget is so disappointing. Keep giving kickbacks to the companies that suck all the money out of the province while you take it from your municipalities and people.They cut programs that help fund this innovation. Such a backwards way of thinking IMO.

What frustrates me as a Canadian, when analysed, the metrics consistently point to Canada as top 3 to 5 countries in the world to live. Study after study conducted by numerous authorities.

Yet, that ain't good enough for some. Pisses me off.

What frustrates me as a Canadian, when analysed, the metrics consistently point to Canada as top 3 to 5 countries in the world to live. Study after study conducted by numerous authorities.

Yet, that ain't good enough for some. Pisses me off.
- bloatedmosquito

You’re already here, don’t let the things you cannot control bother you. Canada has some wonderful freedoms and it’s a beautiful place, but, so is Arizona. I enjoy living in Arizona a lot more, despite the issues with their current president.

People look to Canada, globally, to champion environmental issues, like CO2 reduction, alternative energy, etc. all the while not realizing we already produce the cleanest energy in the world and we aren’t huge emitters compared to large nations. We’re only a nation of 36 million people, despite our huge footprint, we’re not a big country.

Canadian politics are one of the reasons we decided to live in the USA, even with all the poop down here, politically, I find Canada to be more frustrating in that sense. No we won’t get shot and killed in Canada but we’ll take our chances down here lol. We (Canada) will implode one day from our own stupidity. All parties are more concerned with their image’s than doing what’s best for our country.

36 million people trying to change the effects of the constantly changing climate is like trying to save the entire salmon population with the 56 Chinook that return to a small river on the islands west coast.

You’re already here, don’t let the things you cannot control bother you. Canada has some wonderful freedoms and it’s a beautiful place, but, so is Arizona. I enjoy living in Arizona a lot more, despite the issues with their current president.

People look to Canada, globally, to champion environmental issues, like CO2 reduction, alternative energy, etc. all the while not realizing we already produce the cleanest energy in the world and we aren’t huge emitters compared to large nations. We’re only a nation of 36 million people, despite our huge footprint, we’re not a big country.

Canadian politics are one of the reasons we decided to live in the USA, even with all the poop down here, politically, I find Canada to be more frustrating in that sense. No we won’t get shot and killed in Canada but we’ll take our chances down here lol. We (Canada) will implode one day from our own stupidity. All parties are more concerned with their image’s than doing what’s best for our country.

36 million people trying to change the effects of the constantly changing climate is like trying to save the entire salmon population with the 56 Chinook that return to a small river on the islands west coast.
- Pacificgem

You think that's any different in the states?

You think that's any different in the states?
- Marwood

The President calls anyone who disagrees with him a democrat. That kind of says it all.

The President calls anyone who disagrees with him a democrat. That kind of says it all.
- golfingsince

Even though Hefty is a disgusting, fat pig, he usually isn't that f*cking stupid.

Even though Hefty is a disgusting, fat pig, he usually isn't that f*cking stupid.
- Marwood

Living in the US is great if you have the means to live above it all. I guess the same can be said for anywhere really, but the divide in the US is so great. In Canada, basic medicare alone makes such a huge difference for the needy as do the better social programs. You have to really not want it in order to not live a decent life here.

Oil (Direct) accounted for 2.8% or about $50B of Canada's GDP in 2018.

All energy direct and indirect including uranium, gas, coal, hydro etc. Accounted for 11% or $230B

According to a new International Monetary Fund (IMF) report, Canada subsidized the fossil fuel industry to the tune of almost $60 billion in 2015 — approximately $1,650 per Canadian.

https://www.imf.org/en/Pu...try-Level-Estimates-46509

The Oil industry directly employed .3 % of the workforce in 2018
Energy directly and indirectly employed 4.4%

https://www.nrcan.gc.ca/s.../energy-and-economy/20062

Stats don't lie

https://www.thestar.com/n...ntry-new-report-says.html

The article is a year old Lefty, but it largely disputes what you posted earlier. These are the G20 nations that emit more than 80% of the greenhouse gasses worldwide. They also make up about 70% of the world's population.

Canada has the highest emissions per person on the entire list at 22 megatonnes, nearly 3 times the average. We need to stop pointing the finger at other countries and do our part. Canada is the 38th country in the world by population, boasts the 11th largest economy and is the seventh biggest emitter.

What do you think the largest contributor to this mess is?

Lefty in shambles.

A new report suggests cleaning up all of the old and unproductive oil and gas wells in Alberta will cost between $40 billion and $70 billion

https://www.google.com/am.../www.cbc.ca/amp/1.5089254

The AER has 200M (3-5%) set aside for cleanup and the UCP is lobbying the federal government to help pay for thier mess.

The latest "Bankruptcy" by Houston Oil and Gas has contributed an estimated 1400 orphan Wells which it cannot/will not pay for cleaning up.

You think that's any different in the states?
- Marwood

When it comes to Trump, no, as much as I think he’s a disgusting human being, he’s an American protectionist. Trudope doesn’t care about what’s best for our country, he only cares about being popular. Trumps policies are truly about protecting American interests. Right or wrong in his delivery, that’s why he got into this.

Living in the US is great if you have the means to live above it all. I guess the same can be said for anywhere really, but the divide in the US is so great. In Canada, basic medicare alone makes such a huge difference for the needy as do the better social programs. You have to really not want it in order to not live a decent life here.
- golfingsince

Above what? Only someone who doesn’t live here would have these false views. Many many, the majority, Americans live on much less than Canadians yet have the same quality of life. Unless you know, you don’t know,I guess