Not sure why it is so complicated, the speaker is teaching, he is simply using the thief to stress his point, you must be on watch for a thief, not knowing when they will come, you don't know when judgement day will come, you must be spiritually prepared for that day, and it is a daily task, not knowing when that day will be.
- wcorvette

It's not difficult to understand.

Not sure why it is so complicated, the speaker is teaching, he is simply using the thief to stress his point, you must be on watch for a thief, not knowing when they will come, you don't know when judgement day will come, you must be spiritually prepared for that day, and it is a daily task, not knowing when that day will be.
- wcorvette

I already pointed out what I believe are two basic problems in comparing Judgment Day/death/the Coming of the Lord to thievery/the thief etc.

1. If you have led a Christian life, you should presumably be not scared/feel bad about Judgment Day. For thereafter, you will attain Heaven. That is a good thing. You should be equanimously, maybe even joyously prepared. In the case of a thief, you would be apprehensively prepared. For thievery is a bad thing.

2. Being prepared or not about Judgment day doesn't affect the chances of its occurrence in the long run. Being prepared for thievery does affect the chances of its occurrence in the long run. In the latter case, the preparation may essentially banish the event you are preparing for.

I am not making fun of anyone's faith. Its not for me, but that is not relevant. I was just pointing out the strangeness to that verse.

I already pointed out what I believe are two basic problems in comparing Judgment Day/death/the Coming of the Lord to thievery/the thief etc.

1. If you have led a Christian life, you should presumably be not scared/feel bad about Judgment Day. For thereafter, you will attain Heaven. That is a good thing. You should be equanimously, maybe even joyously prepared. In the case of a thief, you would be apprehensively prepared. For thievery is a bad thing.

2. Being prepared or not about Judgment day doesn't affect the chances of its occurrence in the long run. Being prepared for thievery does affect the chances of its occurrence in the long run. In the latter case, the preparation may essentially banish the event you are preparing for.

I am not making fun of anyone's faith. Its not for me, but that is not relevant. I was just pointing out the strangeness to that verse.
- PT21

The verse is not comparing the coming of the Lord to the thief. It's just too complicated for you.

I already pointed out what I believe are two basic problems in comparing Judgment Day/death/the Coming of the Lord to thievery/the thief etc.

1. If you have led a Christian life, you should presumably be not scared/feel bad about Judgment Day. For thereafter, you will attain Heaven. That is a good thing. You should be equanimously, maybe even joyously prepared. In the case of a thief, you would be apprehensively prepared. For thievery is a bad thing.

2. Being prepared or not about Judgment day doesn't affect the chances of its occurrence in the long run. Being prepared for thievery does affect the chances of its occurrence in the long run. In the latter case, the preparation may essentially banish the event you are preparing for.

I am not making fun of anyone's faith. Its not for me, but that is not relevant. I was just pointing out the strangeness to that verse.
- PT21

Seems you don't like the analogy, or was it you thought Jesus was also the thief. It was over 2000 years ago, the scrolls had to be translated, there is room for individual interpretation. From a societally standpoint, I am not sure they had a police presence back then, not sure you could call 911, what the teacher said, the analogy used, must be evaluated understanding the society in which they lived. Seems obvious, back then, people were responsible for their own personal security. Back then, your livelihood was related to your home and property, protecting your livestock and crops. The loss of your livelihood, it being stolen, had to be a big fear. The only bigger fear, losing your salvation.

The verse is not comparing the coming of the Lord to the thief. It's just too complicated for you.
- MJL

Yeah. Say it a few more times. Surely endless repetition makes truth of propositions.

The only guy who gave me a logical response was MBFF. The call for the switching of energy to more spiritual purposes was clever. Though insubstantiated by the text and the interpretations of that verse on the infosphere.

Seems you don't like the analogy, or was it you thought Jesus was also the thief. It was over 2000 years ago, the scrolls had to be translated, there is room for individual interpretation. From a societally standpoint, I am not sure they had a police presence back then, not sure you could call 911, what the teacher said, the analogy used, must be evaluated understanding the society in which they lived. Seems obvious, back then, people were responsible for their own personal security. Back then, your livelihood was related to your home and property, protecting your livestock and crops. The loss of your livelihood, it being stolen, had to be a big fear. The only bigger fear, losing your salvation.
- wcorvette

It is a clumsy metaphor. Goat herding is no excuse for intellectual sloppiness.

Me liking it has nothing to do with it. Neither does all the rest of the stuff you wrote.

Yeah. Say it a few more times. Surely endless repetition makes truth of propositions.

The only guy who gave me a logical response was MBFF. The call for the switching of energy to more spiritual purposes was clever. Though insubstantiated by the text and the interpretations of that verse on the infosphere.
- PT21

Here's another interpretation for you to read to see if you can understand it.


https://fpcjackson.org/re...rmons/therefore-be-ready/


Relevant parts

Jesus is speaking to us in this passage about spiritual preparedness. And He is telling us that to be spiritually unprepared for the day of His coming, would be the worst disaster that could ever befall a human being. No unpreparedness which we have ever experienced in life can possibly be compared to the kind of spiritual unpreparedness about which Jesus is warning today. And I would like you to look with me at this passage very briefly. Jesus gives some very practical challenges to us about spiritual preparation. In verse 42, He tells us that we ought to be prepared because of what we don’t know. In verse 43, He gives us an illustration which we will all be able to relate to about someone not being prepared in this life. And then in verse 44, he tells us that we ought to be prepared because of what we do know. Let’s look at this passage together today very briefly.

It is a clumsy metaphor. Goat herding is no excuse for intellectual sloppiness.

Me liking it has nothing to do with it. Neither does all the rest of the stuff you wrote.
- PT21

Intellectual sloppiness.

It is a clumsy metaphor. Goat herding is no excuse for intellectual sloppiness.

Me liking it has nothing to do with it. Neither does all the rest of the stuff you wrote.
- PT21

So now it is about the intellectual part of it. I guess the scholars were not up to your standard back then, fair enough. Like all of us, you are welcome to your interpretation. I find the comparison, based upon the setting, to be appropriate, you know that "other stuff" I wrote.

So now it is about the intellectual part of it. I guess the scholars were not up to your standard back then, fair enough. Like all of us, you are welcome to your interpretation. I find the comparison, based upon the setting, to be appropriate, you know that "other stuff" I wrote.
- wcorvette

I thought I was very clear this is indeed only about the intellectual part of it.

The problem is not that the verse doesn't meet my intellectual standards. The problem is that it meets yours.

Here's another interpretation for you to read to see if you can understand it.


https://fpcjackson.org/re...rmons/therefore-be-ready/


Relevant parts

Jesus is speaking to us in this passage about spiritual preparedness. And He is telling us that to be spiritually unprepared for the day of His coming, would be the worst disaster that could ever befall a human being. No unpreparedness which we have ever experienced in life can possibly be compared to the kind of spiritual unpreparedness about which Jesus is warning today. And I would like you to look with me at this passage very briefly. Jesus gives some very practical challenges to us about spiritual preparation. In verse 42, He tells us that we ought to be prepared because of what we don’t know. In verse 43, He gives us an illustration which we will all be able to relate to about someone not being prepared in this life. And then in verse 44, he tells us that we ought to be prepared because of what we do know. Let’s look at this passage together today very briefly.
- MJL

NOTHING here requires deviation from the objections posted.

NOTHING here requires deviation from the objections posted.
- PT21

Of course it does. It proves you to be incorrect.

I thought I was very clear this is indeed only about the intellectual part of it.

The problem is not that the verse doesn't meet my intellectual standards. The problem is that it meets yours.
- PT21

yea, you are who you are, only you have to be comfortable with that, it is probably good you are unique, then again it depends on the "unique".

yea, you are who you are, only you have to be comfortable with that, it is probably good you are unique, then again it depends on the "unique".
- wcorvette

I did however figure out what was likely meant.

The act of theft is not being compared to death, or judgment. It is being compared to being judged to not have led a virtuous life.

Just as you can prepare against theft and banish its possibility, so you can prepare against being judged unworthy to enter heaven by leading a virtuous life.

It is a call to daily virtue, not a call for mental acceptance of an inveitability.

None of you made this subtle point.

Btw, stop babbling please. Make use of your words/brain to say something, not just make neutral noises.

I did however figure out what was likely meant.

The act of theft is not being compared to death, or judgment. It is being compared to being judged to not have led a virtuous life.

Just as you can prepare against theft and banish its possibility, so you can prepare against being judged unworthy to enter heaven by leading a virtuous life.

It is a call to daily virtue, not a call for mental acceptance of an inveitability.

None of you made this subtle point.

Btw, stop babbling please. Make use of your words/brain to say something, not just make neutral noises.
- PT21

Actually we have, you were just too busy ignorantly arguing your own foolish position. Perhaps you need to review.

Here are a few examples from this thread.


https://www.hockeybuzz.co...p?thread_id=188695&page=8

" To live your life in a Christian manner and to do good deeds to prepare for your time."

https://www.hockeybuzz.co...p?thread_id=188695&page=8

Its about effort and where you apply your energy

https://www.hockeybuzz.co...p?thread_id=188695&page=9

you don't know when judgement day will come, you must be spiritually prepared for that day, and it is a daily task, not knowing when that day will be.








You need to first look within yourself before you arrogantly attempt to give others advice. The overwhelming majority of your statements are arrogant and ignorant babble desperately attempting to prove that you are superior. You're too ignorant to realize what you have actually done to yourself.

Actually we have, you were just too busy ignorantly arguing your own foolish position. Perhaps you need to review.

Here are a few examples from this thread.


https://www.hockeybuzz.co...p?thread_id=188695&page=8

" To live your life in a Christian manner and to do good deeds to prepare for your time."

https://www.hockeybuzz.co...p?thread_id=188695&page=8

Its about effort and where you apply your energy

https://www.hockeybuzz.co...p?thread_id=188695&page=9

you don't know when judgement day will come, you must be spiritually prepared for that day, and it is a daily task, not knowing when that day will be.








You need to first look within yourself before you arrogantly attempt to give others advice. The overwhelming majority of your statements are arrogant and ignorant babble desperately attempting to prove that you are superior. You're too ignorant to realize what you have actually done to yourself.
- MJL

Can you, for the love of GOD, stop editing your posts responding to me? Some edits take place HOURS after first posting. I assure you I am not worth it.

Those quotes you provided: they were explicating the verse. I was not providing moral instruction. Though, I am very attracted to the role of a revival style preacher or even a fire-and-brimstone type in black baptist churches.

In one of the earlier versions of the post which I glanced at several hours earlier but was too busy to respond to, you asked me what I had done with my life. That would be a long story but let me simply say that today I have managed to muse out aloud and led myself and others (not you, you are too thick-headed) to a far better understanding of a Biblical verse which many religious minded here seem to appreciate in the general but not understand in the particular.

Of course, the process could have been made efficient if someone had pointed out the following equivalancies:

State of being robbed <=> state of being denied heaven*
Daily vigilance to prevent being robbed <=> Daily vigilance in being virtuous and avoiding * above.

What, if I may ask, have you done with your life? When you show up to be judged, the heavenly entities (God/St. Peter) will undoubtedly be so consumed in hilarity that they will piddle a storm on earth that will make Sandy look like a spring shower.

How do you intend to compensate earthlings for that future deluge, eh?

Can you, for the love of GOD, stop editing your posts responding to me? Some edits take place HOURS after first posting. I assure you I am not worth it.


- PT21

Go (frank) yourself. I will do as I please with my posts.

Those quotes you provided: they were explicating the verse. I was not providing moral instruction. Though, I am very attracted to the role of a revival style preacher or even a fire-and-brimstone type in black baptist churches.

In one of the earlier versions of the post which I glanced at several hours earlier but was too busy to respond to, you asked me what I had done with my life. That would be a long story but let me simply say that today I have managed to muse out aloud and led myself and others (not you, you are too thick-headed) to a far better understanding of a Biblical verse which many religious minded here seem to appreciate in the general but not understand in the particular.

Of course, the process could have been made efficient if someone had pointed out the following equivalancies:

State of being robbed <=> state of being denied heaven*
Daily vigilance to prevent being robbed <=> Daily vigilance in being virtuous and avoiding * above.

What, if I may ask, have you done with your life? When you show up to be judged, the heavenly entities (God/St. Peter) will undoubtedly be so consumed in hilarity that they will piddle a storm on earth that will make Sandy look like a spring shower.

How do you intend to compensate earthlings for that future deluge, eh?
- PT21

There is no statement that I have made in this thread, asking you what you have done with your life. As usual, you are confused.

Here is what you actually did. You attempted, as you always have, to post some ridiculous nonsense in a clearly wrong interpretation of the passage, to try and prove yourself superior.

The correct interpretation of the passage was given to you by myself and a few others. You resisted that, stubbornly trying to hang on to the minutia you were spewing. Even claiming to have phones a friend, which obviously didn't happen in an attempt to appeal to authority. Hours later you laughably claim to have led yourself AND OTHERS to the correct conclusion. LOL. The timeline is documented in the thread. It was given to you, hours before! Your lack of self awareness is astounding.

To top it all off, you're still wrong about the verse! LMAO

The only thing that you have led yourself in, is again, making an ass of yourself.

Now here you are trying to judge my status for gaining eternal happiness into the kingdom of heaven. Talk about arrogance.

I'll tell you what I'm not. I'm not the arrogant, elitist, racist scum that you are.

Go (frank) yourself. I will do as I please with my posts.



There is no statement that I have made in this thread, asking you what you have done with your life. As usual, you are confused.

..

The correct interpretation of the passage was given to you by myself and a few others.
- MJL

Were the words what have you "done to yourself" then?

No one provided me with anything close to this interpretation. Most were full of generic spiritual banalities (except MBFF as noted before)

Your attempts were particularly pitiful.

Were the words what have you "done to yourself" then?

No one provided me with anything close to this interpretation. Most were full of generic spiritual banalities (except MBFF as noted before)

Your attempts were particularly pitiful.

- PT21

You were given the exact interpretation. Including links to corroborate it. I could give you a dozen more. You're ignorant and your response here is childish.

You were given the exact interpretation. Including links to corroborate it. I could give you a dozen more. You're ignorant and your response here is childish.
- MJL

No. All posters stressed the mental, spiritual aspect: preparing yourself for Judgment Day, being ready always to meet your maker etc. The link to the actionable, non-mental part: of being virtuous enough in deed to avoid going to hell in the same way that being vigilant avoids being robbed was, at best, implicit and likely absent

I was however certainly arrogant in deigning to believe that the quoted part could be so dismissively interpreted. If it has survived Aquinas, Nietsche and Niebuhr, it will survive some dumbass on Hockeybuzz. The metaphor was much deeper than I initially believed.

The reason you are struggling with it, why it is clearly going over your head is becaue you struggle nowadays with any form of mental connections. You always had a screw loose about believing you can prove your point by pathological argumentation. 5 odd years ago, I started to notice that you failed to follow things, which was a completely different issue. That happened twice a week or so. Now, it happens every day, several times a day.

By all means, call me all the names you like. I am unimportant. But think of your family if you stop at that.

And those of the others who are your well-wishers, consider the trade off between being understandably diffident in venturing into personal domains, and the possibility of being a tacit accomplice to harm.

No. All posters stressed the mental, spiritual aspect: preparing yourself for Judgment Day, being ready always to meet your maker etc. The link to the actionable, non-mental part: of being virtuous enough in deed to avoid going to hell in the same way that being vigilant avoids being robbed was, at best, implicit and likely absent

I was however certainly arrogant in deigning to believe that the quoted part could be so dismissively interpreted. If it has survived Aquinas, Nietsche and Niebuhr, it will survive some dumbass on Hockeybuzz. The metaphor was much deeper than I initially believed.

The reason you are struggling with it, why it is clearly going over your head is becaue you struggle nowadays with any form of mental connections. You always had a screw loose about believing you can prove your point by pathological argumentation. 5 odd years ago, I started to notice that you failed to follow things, which was a completely different issue. That happened twice a week or so. Now, it happens every day, several times a day.

By all means, call me all the names you like. I am unimportant. But think of your family if you stop at that.

And those of the others who are your well-wishers, consider the trade off between being understandably diffident in venturing into personal domains, and the possibility of being a tacit accomplice to harm.
- PT21

Oh PT, you poor soul. That's not going to work. You can't even grasp that the passage is not a metaphor.

Here are the facts. I posted the correct interpretation of the passage. I provided multiple links that corroborated my interpretation.

You incorrectly interpreted the passage and offered zero corroboration. It does not exist. You continued to argue excessively, even after clearly being proven wrong. You then laughably claimed that your "process" led yourself and others to the correct interpretation. Your ego just couldn't admit that you were wrong without giving yourself some form of credit.

Clearly you are the one with mental deficiencies. Clearly I have once again proven that I'm smarter than you are. Think of your family and how difficult it must be for them to live with such a pompous ass. One would hope that you are different in real life. I hope you don't have children. Because I'd hate for them to grow up to be the indoctrinated, brainwashed, unintelligent racist scum bag that you are.

Your post above shows how desperately pathetic you are. Every interaction we have, just exposes you more and more. You are diseased and you can't stop. You simply can't handle that you aren't who you want to be. Like a junkie needing a fix, you will keep trying to acquire. I'm the antidote for the poison that you are and you can't do a dam thing about it.

You are the poster child for the Dunning-Kruger effect.

Well, I didn't mean to spark such a heated, and frankly fascinating, debate by my post. It was just the first thing that came to my mind when I heard about this horrific tragedy. As I hope you all know, I try to keep non hockey related content off this forum, but in this case I felt propelled to share my thoughts once I read the post from Phillywhiteout, where he said it's times like these that make us question our faith. To be honest, I have heard this a lot in my lifetime and I really cannot understand it. To me, it's times like these that drive me to lean on my faith; I mean, what else is there? And if you can't lean on your faith when things like this happen, what good is it? I am a deeply spiritual person, or at least I try to be. It's how I was raised and I really don't know how to be anything different. With all the evil we see and read about every day, along with story after story of senseless death we are subjected to, I can't imagine how those without faith can cope with it all. In the end, we all have family and friends that we love and cherish, and Bill was right when he said perhaps this is a good time to hug them and let them know how much they mean to us. And, for those who have faith my only advise is don't be afraid to lean all of yourself on it, it will get you through. For those who don't have it, I hope this debate might get you to think more about it. Peace.

Well, I didn't mean to spark such a heated, and frankly fascinating, debate by my post. It was just the first thing that came to my mind when I heard about this horrific tragedy. As I hope you all know, I try to keep non hockey related content off this forum, but in this case I felt propelled to share my thoughts once I read the post from Phillywhiteout, where he said it's times like these that make us question our faith. To be honest, I have heard this a lot in my lifetime and I really cannot understand it. To me, it's times like these that drive me to lean on my faith; I mean, what else is there? And if you can't lean on your faith when things like this happen, what good is it? I am a deeply spiritual person, or at least I try to be. It's how I was raised and I really don't know how to be anything different. With all the evil we see and read about every day, along with story after story of senseless death we are subjected to, I can't imagine how those without faith can cope with it all. In the end, we all have family and friends that we love and cherish, and Bill was right when he said perhaps this is a good time to hug them and let them know how much they mean to us. And, for those who have faith my only advise is don't be afraid to lean all of yourself on it, it will get you through. For those who don't have it, I hope this debate might get you to think more about it. Peace.
- jd250

On this, we are without a doubt on the same page.

Well, I didn't mean to spark such a heated, and frankly fascinating, debate by my post. It was just the first thing that came to my mind when I heard about this horrific tragedy. As I hope you all know, I try to keep non hockey related content off this forum, but in this case I felt propelled to share my thoughts once I read the post from Phillywhiteout, where he said it's times like these that make us question our faith. To be honest, I have heard this a lot in my lifetime and I really cannot understand it. To me, it's times like these that drive me to lean on my faith; I mean, what else is there? And if you can't lean on your faith when things like this happen, what good is it? I am a deeply spiritual person, or at least I try to be. It's how I was raised and I really don't know how to be anything different. With all the evil we see and read about every day, along with story after story of senseless death we are subjected to, I can't imagine how those without faith can cope with it all. In the end, we all have family and friends that we love and cherish, and Bill was right when he said perhaps this is a good time to hug them and let them know how much they mean to us. And, for those who have faith my only advise is don't be afraid to lean all of yourself on it, it will get you through. For those who don't have it, I hope this debate might get you to think more about it. Peace.
- jd250

Thanks for posting it. I learned something. I am always grateful when that happens. Someday more appropriate, I will post the pov of atheists for dealing with large events like this.

I have a question though. The manner in which you posted it suggests you believed the verse is calling for a mental readiness to face judgement. To be aware that death could come anytime and to be spiritually ready.

But the actionable part of the verse: that you must live your life virtuously, and that the virtuous actions were like making your house burglar proof, and that the house burglered = being sent to hell: you did not mention that explicitly (no one did).

Was that implicit in your understanding or was that a deeper layer you did not realize?

Thanks for posting it. I learned something. I am always grateful when that happens. Someday more appropriate, I will post the pov of atheists for dealing with large events like this.

I have a question though. The manner in which you posted it suggests you believed the verse is calling for a mental readiness to face judgement. To be aware that death could come anytime and to be spiritually ready.

But the actionable part of the verse: that you must live your life virtuously, and that the virtuous actions were like making your house burglar proof, and that the house burglered = being sent to hell: you did not mention that explicitly (no one did).

Was that implicit in your understanding or was that a deeper layer you did not realize?
- PT21

You keep falsely looking at it as a metaphor. It is not a metaphor. The Bible does not use metaphors. The house being burglarized does not equal being sent to hell. That was not the intent of the passage. As if the Bible would state that if you become a victim of wrong doing by someone else, completely out of your control, you would go to hell. You don't understand the Bible. You continue to arrogantly believe that you have a standing or the intelligence to educate people.