Good. Hayes, ATCh, Lizotte, Bell looked like men playing against boys.

Bad, Mcgroarty didn’t have a pluse in the entire game.

Worse. Graves (frank)ing sucks

Terrible. Mike Sullivan.
- Grinder47

Its been hard watching Graves these past two games hahah F sakes and I figured McGroarty would be more of a battler....basically be a lot more noticeable than he has been haha.

Your good here is really good because I think no matter what those 3 were going to be in the lineup opening night...and I agree all three of those looked good in what I saw... which was roughly 2/3rds of the game. Loved Atch's desperation to dive and stop that empty netter with his stick in a preseason game.

Its been hard watching Graves these past two games hahah F sakes and I figured McGroarty would be more of a battler....basically be a lot more noticeable than he has been haha.

Your good here is really good because I think no matter what those 3 were going to be in the lineup opening night...and I agree all three of those looked good in what I saw... which was roughly 2/3rds of the game. Loved Atch's desperation to dive and stop that empty netter with his stick in a preseason game.
- MattStrat

Lizette and Accairi are on the same page as how they want to play. Had some nice cycles that ended up with chances around the net, which is what you want for an actual NHL 4th line. Not just get let’s play the AHL 1st line which is the misguided mentality a lot of guys around here have.

Lizette and Accairi are on the same page as how they want to play. Had some nice cycles that ended up with chances around the net, which is what you want for an actual NHL 4th line. Not just get let’s play the AHL 1st line which is the misguided mentality a lot of guys around here have.
- Grinder47

You want a 4th line that can keep it deep and wear down the other teams top lines, produce a bit as well. One that can be relied on to eat some minutes, but not be a liability, let the big dogs get rest and contain their big dogs sometimes. We've had a lot of 4th lines over the years, especially the last half a dozen or so, void of 1st line AHLer's that were buried in own zone a lot. Like any other other line there needs to be a bit of a mix of skill sets IMO.

I should probably say "void of quality/high end 1st line AHLers". Just because they were first line in WBS, and called up sometimes, it doesn't mean they would be on a lot of other AHL teams top line haha.

Players supposedly fighting for positions with a head coach who apparently couldn't get them ready for the first period. No doubt, these are practice games but if the coaches can't get them fired-up with their roster spots on the line - that's not a good sign.

Its been hard watching Graves these past two games hahah F sakes and I figured McGroarty would be more of a battler....basically be a lot more noticeable than he has been haha.

Your good here is really good because I think no matter what those 3 were going to be in the lineup opening night...and I agree all three of those looked good in what I saw... which was roughly 2/3rds of the game. Loved Atch's desperation to dive and stop that empty netter with his stick in a preseason game.
- MattStrat

We will find out if Dubas has any guts at the start of the season. Will he admit that the Graves signing was a disaster and bury him in the AHL or not? Graves got his contract and just packed it in. Make him ride on the bus and live away from his home in WBS... they told him at the end of last year he needed to be better... he doesn't seem to have cared much about getting his game back.

Its crazy to think there were a ton of people penciling in McGroaty on the top line with Sid, lol. I thought best case was that he would sit the first 3/4 of the season in WBS, but it could be a couple years before we see him. He will be a decent player, possibly a really good one but nothing about his game is exceptional, so it will take time for him to get there.

Its been hard watching Graves these past two games hahah F sakes and I figured McGroarty would be more of a battler....basically be a lot more noticeable than he has been haha.

Your good here is really good because I think no matter what those 3 were going to be in the lineup opening night...and I agree all three of those looked good in what I saw... which was roughly 2/3rds of the game. Loved Atch's desperation to dive and stop that empty netter with his stick in a preseason game.
- MattStrat

The whole team in general was a$s last night in the 1st. I thought McGroarty and Glass were much more noticeable in the 2nd and 3rd. Kind of like a light went on for both of them. That line gelled as the game went on. Hard to predict after two games, but I think Glass and Pulj will make the team. McG will get sent to the AHL. It's a numbers game and he should be playing on the 1st line down there.

I'm intrigued by Glass. He's got some skill and skates well for his size. Pierre McGuire was on Maddens show yesterday talking him up.

If Hayes can center a 3rd line like he did last night, this team will be better.

I think Poulin took those two dumb penalties to get out of town ASAP. The sooner he latches on with another team the better.

We will find out if Dubas has any guts at the start of the season. Will he admit that the Graves signing was a disaster and bury him in the AHL or not? Graves got his contract and just packed it in. Make him ride on the bus and live away from his home in WBS... they told him at the end of last year he needed to be better... he doesn't seem to have cared much about getting his game back.

Its crazy to think there were a ton of people penciling in McGroaty on the top line with Sid, lol. I thought best case was that he would sit the first 3/4 of the season in WBS, but it could be a couple years before we see him. He will be a decent player, possibly a really good one but nothing about his game is exceptional, so it will take time for him to get there.
- MacPatty

He won't.

I think Poulin took those two dumb penalties to get out of town ASAP. The sooner he latches on with another team the better.
- madmike71

He was trying to fight that big Russian kid in the second. I think he’s had enough of playing in the Sullivan show.

The whole team in general was a$s last night in the 1st. I thought McGroarty and Glass were much more noticeable in the 2nd and 3rd. Kind of like a light went on for both of them. That line gelled as the game went on. Hard to predict after two games, but I think Glass and Pulj will make the team. McG will get sent to the AHL. It's a numbers game and he should be playing on the 1st line down there.

I'm intrigued by Glass. He's got some skill and skates well for his size. Pierre McGuire was on Maddens show yesterday talking him up.

If Hayes can center a 3rd line like he did last night, this team will be better.
- madmike71

And Eller as 4C? Might be the other way around..but either way, if Hayes can play like we've seen so far they are better down the middle this season. There's also Lizotte there as well. I dont see them making Eller a winger, I think it'll either be Hayes or Lizotte going to wing. Of course, in saying all of that its not like opening night setup is going to stick or there wont be injuries haha.

And Eller as 4C? Might be the other way around..but either way, if Hayes can play like we've seen so far the are better down the middle this season. There's also Lizotte there as well. I dont see them making Eller a winger, I think it'll either be Hayes or Lizotte going to wing. Of course, in saying all of that its not like opening night setup is giong to stick or there wont be injuries haha.
- MattStrat

I'd start with Hayes at 3C. Make sure he has speed on his wings. I love Eller at 4C with Lizotte at wing. Right, I like the options at center.

And Eller as 4C? Might be the other way around..but either way, if Hayes can play like we've seen so far they are better down the middle this season. There's also Lizotte there as well. I dont see them making Eller a winger, I think it'll either be Hayes or Lizotte going to wing. Of course, in saying all of that its not like opening night setup is going to stick or there wont be injuries haha.
- MattStrat

Lines today. I'm not sure if the third line is in the right spots:
DOC-Sid-Rust
Bunting-Malkin-Rackell
Hayes-Eller-Glass
Beau-Lizotte-Accairi
McGroarty-Ponomarov-Pulj

So they may play both Eller and Hayes on the third.
DOC back to the first line.

Lines today. I'm not sure if the third line is in the right spots:
DOC-Sid-Rust
Bunting-Malkin-Rackell
Hayes-Eller-Glass
Beau-Lizotte-Accairi
McGroarty-Ponomarov-Pulj

So they may play both Eller and Hayes on the third.
DOC back to the first line.
- Tojo.

Honestly I would like to see:

Beau/DOC - Eller - Hayes (more of a threat to score)
Glass - Lizotte - Acciari (defensive/shutdown line)

STOCK UP:
Puljujarvi- through 2 scrimmages and an exhibition game he's averaging a goal a period. Noticably faster, back checking hard, mixing it up. Has clearly separated from the bubble pack and should maybe pushing to be in the opening lineup in my eyes

St. Ivany- seems to be looking better even than he did last year. Had the option to go down but instead looks to be winning the sixth forward job

Ponomarev- faster than I thought. He's played well enough he's probably bumped a head of most of the bubble guys. Though not good enough to make the top 12 so still likely to start in WBS.

Kevin Hayes- he's been one of the better players in camp with 4 goals in the scrimmage and another last night. Seems to have enough left to start on the third line

Avery Hayes- was an after thought after missing most of last year. He's stood out for scoring and playing a little physical. Was a two time forty goal scorer in juniors so he's got some talent and might have a shot.

Broz- has had a real nice camp mixing speed, grit, and skill. Might be pushing sooner than I thought.

STOCK DOWN
Graves- just doesn't looked like he's taken serious the need to improve. They don't even seem like they've considered him for a top four role

Puustinen, Bennstrom, Poulin- for guys that needed to make the team and should be able to, none have stood out so far. One might still make it as a fourteenth forward rather than get sent on waivers if McGroarty or Ponomarev doesn't make the team, but they all have work to do to play for the Pens this year.

McGroarty- maybe expectations were too high. Shows flashes of being a good two way player, but looks like he could still use some work. Not as physically assertive as you'd expect from a supposed power forward. Could still put it together quickly and be up mid season though because he does look better than any of the other prospects, just not good enough to push a vet off a spot or to look like he couldn't use some AHL time.

Honestly I would like to see:

Beau/DOC - Eller - Hayes (more of a threat to score)
Glass - Lizotte - Acciari (defensive/shutdown line)
- 123Kid

I wonder if Eller and Hayes together is just too slow. Not against trying it, but I wouldn't mind:
Beau-Hayes-Glass/Puljujarvi
Lizotte-Eller-Accairi

I wonder if Eller and Hayes together is just too slow. Not against trying it, but I wouldn't mind:
Beau-Hayes-Glass/Puljujarvi
Lizotte-Eller-Accairi
- Tojo.

Pretty much spot on with your camp assessment IMO. I think Glass is a stock up guy. He was good last night.

St. Ivany is practicing with Petts on the top PK unit. He's made the team already.

From Haase on Avery Hayes:

Mike Sullivan really likes Avery Hayes, just compared him to Mats Zuccarello. He’s only on an AHL deal so can’t be recalled but worth keeping an eye on as someone who could earn an NHL deal. Sullivan said he earned these preseason games by playing well in the Prospects Challenge. He could keep earning more.

I didnt see most of Neds half game, how'd he look?

I thought Bloom looked awesome in his half game.

STOCK UP:
Puljujarvi- through 2 scrimmages and an exhibition game he's averaging a goal a period. Noticably faster, back checking hard, mixing it up. Has clearly separated from the bubble pack and should maybe pushing to be in the opening lineup in my eyes

St. Ivany- seems to be looking better even than he did last year. Had the option to go down but instead looks to be winning the sixth forward job

Ponomarev- faster than I thought. He's played well enough he's probably bumped a head of most of the bubble guys. Though not good enough to make the top 12 so still likely to start in WBS.

Kevin Hayes- he's been one of the better players in camp with 4 goals in the scrimmage and another last night. Seems to have enough left to start on the third line

Avery Hayes- was an after thought after missing most of last year. He's stood out for scoring and playing a little physical. Was a two time forty goal scorer in juniors so he's got some talent and might have a shot.

Broz- has had a real nice camp mixing speed, grit, and skill. Might be pushing sooner than I thought.

STOCK DOWN
Graves- just doesn't looked like he's taken serious the need to improve. They don't even seem like they've considered him for a top four role

Puustinen, Bennstrom, Poulin- for guys that needed to make the team and should be able to, none have stood out so far. One might still make it as a fourteenth forward rather than get sent on waivers if McGroarty or Ponomarev doesn't make the team, but they all have work to do to play for the Pens this year.

McGroarty- maybe expectations were too high. Shows flashes of being a good two way player, but looks like he could still use some work. Not as physically assertive as you'd expect from a supposed power forward. Could still put it together quickly and be up mid season though because he does look better than any of the other prospects, just not good enough to push a vet off a spot or to look like he couldn't use some AHL time.
- Tojo.

Good post, bud.

STOCK UP:
Puljujarvi- through 2 scrimmages and an exhibition game he's averaging a goal a period. Noticably faster, back checking hard, mixing it up. Has clearly separated from the bubble pack and should maybe pushing to be in the opening lineup in my eyes

St. Ivany- seems to be looking better even than he did last year. Had the option to go down but instead looks to be winning the sixth forward job

Ponomarev- faster than I thought. He's played well enough he's probably bumped a head of most of the bubble guys. Though not good enough to make the top 12 so still likely to start in WBS.

Kevin Hayes- he's been one of the better players in camp with 4 goals in the scrimmage and another last night. Seems to have enough left to start on the third line

Avery Hayes- was an after thought after missing most of last year. He's stood out for scoring and playing a little physical. Was a two time forty goal scorer in juniors so he's got some talent and might have a shot.

Broz- has had a real nice camp mixing speed, grit, and skill. Might be pushing sooner than I thought.

STOCK DOWN
Graves- just doesn't looked like he's taken serious the need to improve. They don't even seem like they've considered him for a top four role

Puustinen, Bennstrom, Poulin- for guys that needed to make the team and should be able to, none have stood out so far. One might still make it as a fourteenth forward rather than get sent on waivers if McGroarty or Ponomarev doesn't make the team, but they all have work to do to play for the Pens this year.

McGroarty- maybe expectations were too high. Shows flashes of being a good two way player, but looks like he could still use some work. Not as physically assertive as you'd expect from a supposed power forward. Could still put it together quickly and be up mid season though because he does look better than any of the other prospects, just not good enough to push a vet off a spot or to look like he couldn't use some AHL time.
- Tojo.

McGroatry’s whole thing was going to a team where he could play now, but he just doesn’t really look ready. Interesting to see what happens here and I wonder what the negotiations with Dubas were. If he was promised a spot this only ends badly.

McGroatry’s whole thing was going to a team where he could play now, but he just doesn’t really look ready. Interesting to see what happens here and I wonder what the negotiations with Dubas were. If he was promised a spot this only ends badly.

Most every trade doesn't have GM's negotiating with prospects. Where do you guys read this STUFF? Rather than assuming weird things - may I suggest just sit back and enjoy the camp.

Most every trade doesn't have GM's negotiating with prospects. Where do you guys read this STUFF? Rather than assuming weird things - may I suggest just sit back and enjoy the camp.
- sufi-judge

This was a completely different situation where McGroarty was seeking a trade and threatening to go back to college and let his rights expire. His camp was involved in the trade discussions because if he didn’t get a desirable outcome he would have just gone back to Michigan and become a college free agent in a year. This wasn’t a normal prospect trade and is a lot more similar to trading for a pending UFA where it’s extremely common to negotiate with the eventual tradee before finalizing

Lines today. I'm not sure if the third line is in the right spots:
DOC-Sid-Rust
Bunting-Malkin-Rackell
Hayes-Eller-Glass
Beau-Lizotte-Accairi
McGroarty-Ponomarov-Pulj

So they may play both Eller and Hayes on the third.
DOC back to the first line.
- Tojo.

The defense with Karlsson out:

Grzelcyk-Letang
Pettersson-Aho
Graves-St Ivany
Shea-Ludvig
Renouf-Brunicke
Pickering-Brickey

The defense with Karlsson out:

Grzelcyk-Letang
Pettersson-Aho
Graves-St Ivany
Shea-Ludvig
Renouf-Brunicke
Pickering-Brickey
- Thunderbolt

If Grzelcyk can hang with Letang that would be huge. At that we can just kinda be done with Graves.

Point on Grzelcyk: he’s two years removed from being an analytics darling. There might be something to reclaim here

McGroatry’s whole thing was going to a team where he could play now, but he just doesn’t really look ready. Interesting to see what happens here and I wonder what the negotiations with Dubas were. If he was promised a spot this only ends badly.
- Victoro311

McG was asked that when he arrived and he said he was only promised a spot in the development camp. He also disputed the leaked reasons for him wanting out of WIN and refused to elaborate, so who knows precisely why he wanted out of there (one can imagine many possibilities).

Ultimately the path for him to the NHL will be wide open by the TDL this year and certainly next year. I'm sure if they send him to the A it'll be with a list of things to work on and the knowledge that he'll be up before the season is over if he improves on those things.

McG was asked that when he arrived and he said he was only promised a spot in the development camp. He also disputed the leaked reasons for him wanting out of WIN and refused to elaborate, so who knows precisely why he wanted out of there (one can imagine many possibilities).

Ultimately the path for him to the NHL will be wide open by the TDL this year and certainly next year. I'm sure if they send him to the A it'll be with a list of things to work on and the knowledge that he'll be up before the season is over if he improves on those things.
- MickV

Who wants to live in Winnipeg besides Grinder? Makes sense