Tortorella's way is to give his golden boys lots and lots of rope. He loves those "two-way players" without much on the offensive side of "two-way". His whipping boys get very littl rope. He goes by his gut and tends to be rather fickle and emotion-driven. It's how he's always been. He'll give lip service til the cows come home about not stifling offense... but then he'll stifle offense.

Specific to Laughton, he's still a very good penalty killer (NHL's shorthanded scoring leader over the past two seasons in fact). He's still versatile and never gripes about being yo-yoed from C to LW or vice versa, top-nine or fourth line. Plus he IS still the internal voice and finger on the pulse in the room. So there's still a spot for him.

Here's the thing, as I see it. Individually, there's room for any of Laughton, Cates or Poehling. Collectively, though, it gets a bit redundant. They're not identical players, mind you, but they take multiple slots of what I think is more ideally slots for 1 or 2 (max).

Do I have a fear that Luchanko will not be properly developed as an offensive player up to his ceiling because they're satisfied with his speed and defensive upside? Yes, I do have that concern.
- bmeltzer

Hard to disagree with any of this and i hate to bring this up but what is the NHL's largest analytics department up to these days if they aren't helping the big club on game days?

Got to admit, Jett has looked solid. He is a nice surprise. I was caught of guard when they traded down and then picked him. He wasn’t on my radar.

I’m starting to warm up to the pick. He may not stick in the NHL (I would be surprised again if he sticks), but he has shown lots of promise.

Now back to Michkov talk. That guy is fun to watch. Almost every shift he sticks out in a good way.

Preseason has been enjoyable with him on the ice. The team has a long way to go but it is nice to have a talent like him on the team.

His vision and passing reminds me of the 22 year old G.

Typical phoolies. But how about that exit velocity on Schwarbomb?!
- StepfordSam

That is the problem with the Phils -- it is a ton of batters that hit 245 ish, a few that can flirt with 290, and a few with speed that is never utilized. The BP has been an issue to me all season, and getting a crappy closer did nothing to help the BP

Wheeler did his job - the team failed him -- The Boys PE teacher at my school is a yankess fan -- I told him mets in 4 - he was shocked -- the Phillies have been mediocre since London

Ther are no similarities between Coots and Luchenko. Coots was a checking center because the talent around him demanded it. Luchenko has a lot more skill to work with on hios wing with his wingers likely being Farabee and Brink. Couiturier was often blocked as well. Flyers always had someone playing above him. Luchenko has Torts favour while Coots and Frost do not. If he performs well he will be elevated. It isnt as if Coots never hit hios ceiling either. It just took him maybe a year or two longer.

That being said, I still dont think he sticks with the team for the full season.
- xShoot4WarAmpsx

Again, you missed the point. The premise is that regardless of what the reasoning was, which is your incorrect focus in saying that there is no similarity, is that the players development will be held back based on role and deployment. Similar to how Couturier was. Couturier's development into a a high point producer happens much later than just a year or two longer.

Hard to disagree with any of this and i hate to bring this up but what is the NHL's largest analytics department up to these days if they aren't helping the big club on game days?
- Flyers_01

I'm still cracked up about Tortorella's recent comments about how he pondered during the Summer about the Flyers needing to focus more on scoring more greasy goals around the net to increase scoring. A few points are that's how most goals are scored in the NHL and all coaches have a tool to use to show them things like that during the season. Which only a couple of conclusions to draw from that. Either the Flyers analytics department is not good and is not supplying the coach with the right info. Or the coach is asleep at the wheel.

That is the problem with the Phils -- it is a ton of batters that hit 245 ish, a few that can flirt with 290, and a few with speed that is never utilized. The BP has been an issue to me all season, and getting a crappy closer did nothing to help the BP

Wheeler did his job - the team failed him -- The Boys PE teacher at my school is a yankess fan -- I told him mets in 4 - he was shocked -- the Phillies have been mediocre since London
- corduroy

The Phils haven't been a good team in months. 33-33 since the all star break. Momentum and being the hot team matters and the Phils are not the hot team. They just fired their best bullet in Wheeler and lost. They're cooked.

That is the problem with the Phils -- it is a ton of batters that hit 245 ish, a few that can flirt with 290, and a few with speed that is never utilized. The BP has been an issue to me all season, and getting a crappy closer did nothing to help the BP

Wheeler did his job - the team failed him -- The Boys PE teacher at my school is a yankess fan -- I told him mets in 4 - he was shocked -- the Phillies have been mediocre since London
- corduroy

And the Mets have been the hottest 🔥 team in the second part of the season.

That is the problem with the Phils -- it is a ton of batters that hit 245 ish, a few that can flirt with 290, and a few with speed that is never utilized. The BP has been an issue to me all season, and getting a crappy closer did nothing to help the BP

Wheeler did his job - the team failed him -- The Boys PE teacher at my school is a yankess fan -- I told him mets in 4 - he was shocked -- the Phillies have been mediocre since London
- corduroy

That’s a bingo

Again, you missed the point. The premise is that regardless of what the reasoning was, which is your incorrect focus in saying that there is no similarity, is that the players development will be held back based on role and deployment. Similar to how Couturier was. Couturier's development into a a high point producer happens much later than just a year or two longer.
- MJL

And what makes you think, if they sent coots back down that he would produce into a high point producer any sooner

Tortorella's way is to give his golden boys lots and lots of rope. He loves those "two-way players" without much on the offensive side of "two-way". His whipping boys get very littl rope. He goes by his gut and tends to be rather fickle and emotion-driven. It's how he's always been. He'll give lip service til the cows come home about not stifling offense... but then he'll stifle offense.



Specific to Laughton, he's still a very good penalty killer (NHL's shorthanded scoring leader over the past two seasons in fact). He's still versatile and never gripes about being yo-yoed from C to LW or vice versa, top-nine or fourth line. Plus he IS still the internal voice and finger on the pulse in the room. So there's still a spot for him.

Here's the thing, as I see it. Individually, there's room for any of Laughton, Cates or Poehling. Collectively, though, it gets a bit redundant. They're not identical players, mind you, but they take multiple slots of what I think is more ideally slots for 1 or 2 (max).

Do I have a fear that Luchanko will not be properly developed as an offensive player up to his ceiling because they're satisfied with his speed and defensive upside? Yes, I do have that concern.
- bmeltzer

Appreciate it Bill, torts gets in his own way, have to think DB knows this, DB needs to trade some of torts shinny toys

Appreciate it Bill, torts gets in his own way, have to think DB knows this, DB needs to trade some of torts shinny toys
- wcorvette

Danny Briere is heavily influenced by Tortorella and is his puppet.

And what makes you think, if they sent coots back down that he would produce into a high point producer any sooner
- SlNlSTER

https://www.courierposton...he-shutdown-guy/25724761/

"I don't want to be known as only the shutdown guy like it's been for the past few years," Couturier said. "I want to take a step forward offensively and be one of the go-to guys when we're down a goal and need a goal or need some offense."
..
"We're trying to make a bit of an excuse here that I'm using him in the defensive zone too much," Berube said. "He's got a job to do. That's what we need him to do for the team. For him to develop as a better player and a better offensive player, he's gotta learn how to produce, starting in that position."
..
In the first month of the season, Couturier's defensive zone starts were more like 71 percent. He was very much being used in a defensive-first role.

---------------

I'm not sure why this is even an argument. The Flyers used Coots as a cheat code on defense for half a decade, nevermind the rest of his game. The coaches actively ignored the offensive side of his game because he covered up the poor roster construction defensively and allowed the higher profile forwards to focus on offense and to take some pressure off of the usually poorly constructed defensive corps like when they tried to make Andrew McDonald and Luke Schenn top pair dmen.

He would occasionally be given a chance but circumstances would usually conspire against him early in his career. The Flyers chose team over developing the player because they were "all in" every year and that was the best way, in the short term, for Coots to help the team.

Re: Jett, send him back. Not sure what significant benefit can come from keeping him on the 3rd line with the Flyers. Send him to Guelph, let him get his 80 or 90 points, play in the WJC and maybe really shine in that tournament. Bring him up next year when he's a year older and has had a lot of success to build on. Not sure why DB is following Tort's desires when the best thing for the kid is to go back. That's just my opinion. I could be wrong... but I doubt it.
- Letterkenny

Why not give it shot and see what happens? Jett is not the 1st 18 year old to play in the NHL and he won't be the last. 3C is a perfect role for him if he is going to stay in the NHL, and he is playing with two good wingers. If he can't handle it after 9 or so games, he can always go back to Geulph. But why do we always assume the worst every single time the Flyers try something??

Danny Briere is heavily influenced by Tortorella and is his puppet.
- MJL

Starting early this season.

Why not give it shot and see what happens? Jett is not the 1st 18 year old to play in the NHL and he won't be the last. 3C is a perfect role for him if he is going to stay in the NHL, and he is playing with two good wingers. If he can't handle it after 9 or so games, he can always go back to Geulph. But why do we always assume the worst every single time the Flyers try something??
- jd250

experience.

And kudos to the Flyers for trying something different this year to improve the Powerplay. Most on this forum complain day after day that the Flyers are an archaic franchise, doing the same thing over and over again. Well, here is an example where they are trying something different. They have a good group of former players with eyes on the PP and are meeting monthly to see how its going. I'm at least interested in seeing how this works out.

https://www.courierposton...he-shutdown-guy/25724761/

"I don't want to be known as only the shutdown guy like it's been for the past few years," Couturier said. "I want to take a step forward offensively and be one of the go-to guys when we're down a goal and need a goal or need some offense."
..
"We're trying to make a bit of an excuse here that I'm using him in the defensive zone too much," Berube said. "He's got a job to do. That's what we need him to do for the team. For him to develop as a better player and a better offensive player, he's gotta learn how to produce, starting in that position."
..
In the first month of the season, Couturier's defensive zone starts were more like 71 percent. He was very much being used in a defensive-first role.

---------------

I'm not sure why this is even an argument. The Flyers used Coots as a cheat code on defense for half a decade, nevermind the rest of his game. The coaches actively ignored the offensive side of his game because he covered up the poor roster construction defensively and allowed the higher profile forwards to focus on offense and to take some pressure off of the usually poorly constructed defensive corps like when they tried to make Andrew McDonald and Luke Schenn top pair dmen.

He would occasionally be given a chance but circumstances would usually conspire against him early in his career. The Flyers chose team over developing the player because they were "all in" every year and that was the best way, in the short term, for Coots to help the team.
- Flyers_01

I think zone starts are overrated. It's a small percentage of a players shifts in a game. I think it's more about linemates and matchups. Lack of PP time. The Flyers did choose team over developing the player and I think Tortorella is doing the same with Luchanko

Why not give it shot and see what happens? Jett is not the 1st 18 year old to play in the NHL and he won't be the last. 3C is a perfect role for him if he is going to stay in the NHL, and he is playing with two good wingers. If he can't handle it after 9 or so games, he can always go back to Geulph. But why do we always assume the worst every single time the Flyers try something??
- jd250

Because they have been screwing up for the better part of a decade.

Starting early this season.
- jd250

You're not starting. You're continuing to post the same uninformed dumb poop that you always have.

And kudos to the Flyers for trying something different this year to improve the Powerplay. Most on this forum complain day after day that the Flyers are an archaic franchise, doing the same thing over and over again. Well, here is an example where they are trying something different. They have a good group of former players with eyes on the PP and are meeting monthly to see how its going. I'm at least interested in seeing how this works out.
- jd250

Not to put to fine a point on it but the obvious move would be to use the largest analytics dept in the league to give the team some pointers. You know, things like what's working best for other teams, what's the tendencies/weaknesses of goaltender for the next game, what do the Flyers players do well/bad individually, etc.

There is ZERO sign that they are using the most common and easily accessed resources at their disposal that everyone else uses. Is the PP really that much a mystery that the Flyers need a few more guys to see if the Flyers PP passes the "eye test"?

Also, any other team would've fired coaches by now but not the Flyers.

And kudos to the Flyers for trying something different this year to improve the Powerplay. Most on this forum complain day after day that the Flyers are an archaic franchise, doing the same thing over and over again. Well, here is an example where they are trying something different. They have a good group of former players with eyes on the PP and are meeting monthly to see how its going. I'm at least interested in seeing how this works out.
- jd250

What exactly are they doing differently?

Danny Briere is heavily influenced by Tortorella and is his puppet.
- MJL

Nice! You are using new words...."heavily influenced." What about "manipulated?"

Appreciate it Bill, torts gets in his own way, have to think DB knows this, DB needs to trade some of torts shinny toys
- wcorvette

when are you going to comprehend, realize, and accept the coach/CO-GM runs the team at the nhl level?

the other CO-GM needs permission to make a trade. he is a putz.

And kudos to the Flyers for trying something different this year to improve the Powerplay. Most on this forum complain day after day that the Flyers are an archaic franchise, doing the same thing over and over again. Well, here is an example where they are trying something different. They have a good group of former players with eyes on the PP and are meeting monthly to see how its going. I'm at least interested in seeing how this works out.
- jd250

keystone cops.

the PP isnt a hard concept.

meetings every month is funny. why not every week. a competent organization wouldn't need a dozen people to "Figure" it out. wonder who brings the pastry?