The other day looked like growing pains. As the game wore on, they didn't have a surefire method of getting pucks to the net, and sometimes got stuck in their end, unable to make that first pass against the Rangers agressive forecheck. All that to say that Gardiner could have - and now will - make a big difference for them.

On the bright side, Kostka looks really quite comfortable at the NHL level and JVR and Leo Komarov are both playing solid.

Have not heard any talk about him being a "terrible" pick. I think that may be a little but of wishful editorializing on our part perhaps?

I know there is a lot of concern about how his numerous injuries have stunted his development, and that the original time-line they had for his progression is being adjusted.

He's only played 81 pro-games since the season before he was drafted until today, that's not enough games by a long shot to move up on the depth chart.

The sad part is he has had a number of concussions, and those types of injuries don't allow for any time of on or off ice conditioning to try to keep in shape, while waiting to recover.
- Doppleganger

Nah, that's from the radio pundits and so-called experts.

The other day looked like growing pains. As the game wore on, they didn't have a surefire method of getting pucks to the net, and sometimes got stuck in their end, unable to make that first pass against the Rangers agressive forecheck. All that to say that Gardiner could have - and now will - make a big difference for them.

On the bright side, Kostka looks really quite comfortable at the NHL level and JVR and Leo Komarov are both playing solid.
- Morris

I'm hearing a lot of good things about Kostka, even seen him on coach's corner last week, so he must be doing some good things to catch Don's attention.

The other day looked like growing pains. As the game wore on, they didn't have a surefire method of getting pucks to the net, and sometimes got stuck in their end, unable to make that first pass against the Rangers agressive forecheck. All that to say that Gardiner could have - and now will - make a big difference for them.

On the bright side, Kostka looks really quite comfortable at the NHL level and JVR and Leo Komarov are both playing solid.
- Morris

It's funny how some Leaf fans have gone from panic, to euphoria, and back again. Completely out to lunch. Lose to Buffalo - "more of the same again this year". Beat Pitts - "wow, Carlyle is going to make a huge difference this year". Lose to the Isles and collapse against the RAgs - "OMG OMG, IT'S ALL OVER".

They'll be fine this year. I'd say they're actually playing quite well. The collapse against the Isles, isn't uncommon this year in the league, with the second game in two nights, in different cities. Ottawa did the same thing against Tampa on Friday, after playing the night before in Miami, and they're not the only two teams to lose their legs in this situation. It's gonna happen this year, with the compressed schedule, especially when teams play back to back games.

Then they lost to Buffalo, who is a pretty good team, and the Rangers, who are a top team. And they put up a pretty solid fight against both teams.

They've been playing quite well, and there is some pretty solid play from a lot of young guys. Kadri is tearing it up, so is JVR, Frattin is playing well, Kostka.

If anyone expected them to be contenders, they're foolish. It'll all even out after 8 or 10 games, and they'll be somewhere in the middle.

Have not heard any talk about him being a "terrible" pick. I think that may be a little but of wishful editorializing on our part perhaps?

I know there is a lot of concern about how his numerous injuries have stunted his development, and that the original time-line they had for his progression is being adjusted.

He's only played 81 pro-games since the season before he was drafted until today, that's not enough games by a long shot to move up on the depth chart.

The sad part is he has had a number of concussions, and those types of injuries don't allow for any time of on or off ice conditioning to try to keep in shape, while waiting to recover.
- Doppleganger

If the leafs took Z. and he was in the position he is now with Ottawa, the vultures would be circling, telling us how Burke missed the mark again.. look at Scheifele, Couturier, Hamilton taken 3 picks later... what a moron etc etc.

in fact, you might be first in line to criticize.

If the leafs took Z. and he was in the position he is now with Ottawa, the vultures would be circling, telling us how Burke missed the mark again.. look at Scheifele, Couturier, Hamilton taken 3 picks later... what a moron etc etc.

in fact, you might be first in line to criticize.
- senstroll

You have to take into consideration his injury history. He's had a string of them, and not matter who selected him, you can't hammer them because of injuries. Was is wrong to select Cowan, becasue he had a season ending injury?? No one could predict when a player is going to get injured.

You can criticize selections who don't live up to expectations, but not because of injuries.

Schenn was not hounded out of toronto because of injuries, but because of not living up to his potential, and all the pressure that goes with that.

You have to take into consideration his injury history. He's had a string of them, and not matter who selected him, you can't hammer them because of injuries. Was is wrong to select Cowan, becasue he had a season ending injury?? No one could predict when a player is going to get injured.

You can criticize selections who don't live up to expectations, but not because of injuries.

Schenn was not hounded out of toronto because of injuries, but because of not living up to his potential, and all the pressure that goes with that.
- Doppleganger

If you read above, I actually mentioned his injuries. That said, he really has been quite brutal. Even at the AHL level, he doesn't stick out (in a good way at least). So, maybe you can attribute some of it to injuries, but wow, even with that, being so horrible at the AHL level is not so good.

I'm curious to see what happens now that he's been called up. You would think, with the showing he's had so far, he'd be a fixture on the Binghamton Sens for the foreseeable future.

You have to take into consideration his injury history. He's had a string of them, and not matter who selected him, you can't hammer them because of injuries. Was is wrong to select Cowan, becasue he had a season ending injury?? No one could predict when a player is going to get injured.

You can criticize selections who don't live up to expectations, but not because of injuries.

Schenn was not hounded out of toronto because of injuries, but because of not living up to his potential, and all the pressure that goes with that.
- Doppleganger

I agree you have to consider injuries, but people would just say Cowan was hurt before, looks like he is injury prone, you should have known, and Z. was rated lower at the time, you took at chance....thats would people would say if it was the leafs that took cowan and Z.

Schenn was shipped out also because Toronto is starving for a star to lead this team, we dont have one. Kessel and Dion are decent players..not superstars

He's been playing really well. Many, many chances, just not going in, as far as goal scoring goes. But he's been playmaking like I've never seen before. He set up Kostka on some consecutive shifts a couple of games ago three times, point blank, with some passes you don't expect out of people outside of Crosby et al. I believe that was against Buffalo, and Miller was standing on his head. He seems to be doing that fairly often this year so far.

Nothing wrong with Kessel whatsoever right now.
- prock

Played great against the Isles the other night, had a ton of chances. They'll start going in soon for him.

What do you make of all the talk about Zibanejad being a terrible pick? Particulary after him showing he isn't even a capable AHL player at this point. I find it rather interesting, given all the talk from Sens fans last year about him being "a man among boys", and an NHL-ready player. It makes it interesting that he isn't even AHL ready. Thoughts?
- prock

I suggested that upwards of 5 rookies could break into the Ottawa starting roster this coming year. Tomorrow night they will have 4 rookies in their line up including Zibanejad. Not sure what has got your panties in a knot.

I agree you have to consider injuries, but people would just say Cowan was hurt before, looks like he is injury prone, you should have known, and Z. was rated lower at the time, you took at chance....thats would people would say if it was the leafs that took cowan and Z.

Schenn was shipped out also because Toronto is starving for a star to lead this team, we dont have one. Kessel and Dion are decent players..not superstars
- senstroll

No, what people like me are going to say is that a team that did not make the playoffs any year from one lock out to the next should have a better roster of rookies and prospects. You realize that that the Leaf post season record is worse than the Oilers between the lock out years. Why does the Leaf system not have something that at least modestly replicates the young Edmonton roster?

If you read above, I actually mentioned his injuries. That said, he really has been quite brutal. Even at the AHL level, he doesn't stick out (in a good way at least). So, maybe you can attribute some of it to injuries, but wow, even with that, being so horrible at the AHL level is not so good.

I'm curious to see what happens now that he's been called up. You would think, with the showing he's had so far, he'd be a fixture on the Binghamton Sens for the foreseeable future.
- prock

The kid is a horse and a precocious talent. He is a very good a skater has great size and plays a man's game. If, as is now being suggested, he did not have a concussion problem but a whiplash (neck) problem his career should resume.

Curios that it seems to be the same bunch back saying the same silly things. Last year I believe you started the year by insisting Karlsson was not really a good player. I believe it was suggested that he would not be able to break into the Leaf top 4 Dmen. Once it became apparent that Karlsson was the real deal, a Norris winner, some of you moved on the claim that Turris was a failure. The whining on that now seems to disappear and some of you have moved on to Silfverberg and Zibanejad. Hardly a respectable track record in your hockey prognonis.

If the leafs took Z. and he was in the position he is now with Ottawa, the vultures would be circling, telling us how Burke missed the mark again.. look at Scheifele, Couturier, Hamilton taken 3 picks later... what a moron etc etc.

in fact, you might be first in line to criticize.
- senstroll

I think you missed the point of your own point. Burke did miss the mark over and over again. Murray, on the other hand, has used the draft and has built a very strong prospect system. The Baby Sens are the youngest team in the AHL. They are in first place overall. Scoreboard matters.

The kid is a horse and a precocious talent. He is a very good a skater has great size and plays a man's game. If, as is now being suggested, he did not have a concussion problem but a whiplash (neck) problem his career should resume.

Curios that it seems to be the same bunch back saying the same silly things. Last year I believe you started the year by insisting Karlsson was not really a good player. I believe it was suggested that he would not be able to break into the Leaf top 4 Dmen. Once it became apparent that Karlsson was the real deal, a Norris winner, some of you moved on the claim that Turris was a failure. The whining on that now seems to disappear and some of you have moved on to Silfverberg and Zibanejad. Hardly a respectable track record in your hockey prognonis.
- spatso

You seem to be trying to deflect off of how bad he's been.

Karlson can't play D.

Turris still sucks.

You seem to be trying to deflect off of how bad he's been.

Karlson can't play D.

Turris still sucks.
- prock

And, you still have not learned that denial is not a river in Egypt.

And, you still have not learned that denial is not a river in Egypt.
- spatso

Actually, that's the Nile. Denial is something that you practice when you try tell people Karlsson can play D. I was watching the Sens game the other night, they marched him out on the PK, as the shot came in, he was prancing around being completely useless, got totally boxed out, as they popped the puck in the net. Can't play D to save his life. Then the next shift, huge cough up.

Actually, that's the Nile. Denial is something that you practice when you try tell people Karlsson can play D. I was watching the Sens game the other night, they marched him out on the PK, as the shot came in, he was prancing around being completely useless, got totally boxed out, as they popped the puck in the net. Can't play D to save his life. Then the next shift, huge cough up.
- prock

This thread will come full circle once Dopps comes in to claim that the stat sheets don't show that Karlsson coughed it up...

This thread will come full circle once Dopps comes in to claim that the stat sheets don't show that Karlsson coughed it up...
- Morris

LOL.

Hard to deny this one though.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/boxscore.htm?id=2012020053

Look at the video on the first goal. He has absolutely no clue what to do. Then a scrum starts, and he basically stands back and watches. Goal ensues. I watched it, and remembered the ridiculous remarks these guys made, and thought to myself, "holy crap I've never seen someone so useless in his own end."

Actually, that's the Nile. Denial is something that you practice when you try tell people Karlsson can play D. I was watching the Sens game the other night, they marched him out on the PK, as the shot came in, he was prancing around being completely useless, got totally boxed out, as they popped the puck in the net. Can't play D to save his life. Then the next shift, huge cough up.
- prock

Plus/minus is not a final determinant as it is influenced by other team factors. But, comparing the plus/minus of lead Dmen is revealing. As you probably know Phaneuf is -8 and Karlsson is +5. This is the kid you said could not make the starting top 4 rotation of the Leafs. This is the kid you said was a joke if anyone said he should be considered as a Norris nominee. This is the kid who you said will never win the Norris even after he was nominated.

Perhaps your judgment is impaired by jealousy?

Plus/minus is not a final determinant as it is influenced by other team factors. But, comparing the plus/minus of lead Dmen is revealing. As you probably know Phaneuf is -8 and Karlsson is +5. This is the kid you said could not make the starting top 4 rotation of the Leafs. This is the kid you said was a joke if anyone said he should be considered as a Norris nominee. This is the kid who you said will never win the Norris even after he was nominated.

Perhaps your judgment is impaired by jealousy?
- spatso

perhaps you should watch the video and shove your foot up your azz.

LOL.

Hard to deny this one though.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/boxscore.htm?id=2012020053

Look at the video on the first goal. He has absolutely no clue what to do. Then a scrum starts, and he basically stands back and watches. Goal ensues. I watched it, and remembered the ridiculous remarks these guys made, and thought to myself, "holy crap I've never seen someone so useless in his own end."
- prock

Do you remember when Alfredsson, a rookie at the time, made Ray Bourque look like a minor league player as he stepped around him to score an NHL goal. Bourque said afterwards it was the worst he had ever been beaten. It does not alter his first ballot hall of fame status. Great players make bone head plays. Critics grasp at staws when they want to avoid seeing the entire forest.

Do you remember when Alfredsson, a rookie at the time, made Ray Bourque look like a minor league player as he stepped around him to score an NHL goal. Bourque said afterwards it was the worst he had ever been beaten. It does not alter his first ballot hall of fame status. Great players make bone head plays. Critics grasp at staws when they want to avoid seeing the entire forest.
- spatso

bahahahahahaha, deflect deflect deflect.

spazz - Perhaps it's your judgement.
Shows video.
spazz - starts yapping irrelevant BS about retired players.

As soon as I say the name Ray Bourque, I stopped reading.

We should start talking about Puempel and Noesen again, how amazing you thought these guys were, and how they're totally flopping, a year later, a year older, and a year WORSE.

bhahahahaahahaha.

You know, a Leaf prospect got traded to the Kitchener Rangers about a month ago. And he's easily outplaying Puempel.

bahahahahahaha, deflect deflect deflect.

spazz - Perhaps it's your judgement.
Shows video.
spazz - starts yapping irrelevant BS about retired players.

As soon as I say the name Ray Bourque, I stopped reading.

We should start talking about Puempel and Noesen again, how amazing you thought these guys were, and how they're totally flopping, a year later, a year older, and a year WORSE.

bhahahahaahahaha.

You know, a Leaf prospect got traded to the Kitchener Rangers about a month ago. And he's easily outplaying Puempel.
- prock

You seem to be very unhappy. Senator fans and management seem to be delighted with the quality and depth of their player development. Not really sure why you take it all so personally.

You seem to be very unhappy. Senator fans and management seem to be delighted with the quality and depth of their player development. Not really sure why you take it all so personally.
- spatso

what about me laughing at you making stupid comments would make you think that?

what about me laughing at you making stupid comments would make you think that?
- prock

Your comments lack substance. They are most often irrational and, emotionally, rather than factually based. You seem to project your frustration upon successful players, perhaps helping you to avoid disappointment in your own expectations. I cannot be certain but it seems to me that you may be starting the season in an unhappy mood.