Defensively, Erik Karlsson is one of the worst defenseman in the league. But keep referencing those points. While he keeps costing the Sens games because he can't play D.
- prock

You don't have to tell me this, I watch every Senator game, except for those when out of town.

He hopefully will learn from his mistakes, and will become more responsible defensibly as the re-build continues.

He is playing more than he should, taking minutes from two of the top four who are currently out of the line up, so when you're on the ice a lot, handle the puck a lot, you're going to have more mistakes showing up in the stats.

You don't have to tell me this, I watch every Senator game, except for those when out of town.
He hopefully will learn from his mistakes, and will become more responsible defensibly as the re-build continues.

He is playing more than he should, taking minutes from two of the top four who are currently out of the line up, so when you're on the ice a lot, handle the puck a lot, you're going to have more mistakes showing up in the stats.
- Doppleganger

based on your previous comments (Karlsson totally shut down OV- HES AWESOME!), we kinda do.

Please stop being stupid on purpose.

I don't consider it trolling when you make a comparison between Kessel and Michalek as they are wingers and close to the league lead in goals (i.e. they have things to compare)

The same way WAS fans would understand if you made a comparison of Filatov with Semin as they seem to have similar work ethics, similar background, etc... If you started saying something like 'Filatov has accomplished more than Kadri... blah blah blah' you are doing it to annoy people, as the two players have very little in common, and saying that you just 'Randomly' chose Kadri, is not believable at all.

I also can note how every comparison you make with Ottawa players seems to be with a Leaf player (but that must just be a coincidence)

You know why you bring up Leaf players, say what you want. Ottawa forum or not, when you have a title that specifically targets Leaf fans, again you know what you are doing.

That is all
- mfreedman

Wow, thin skinned and able to read my mind.

Once again, leaf fans have been perpetuating the myth that BB fleeced Murray at the 2009 entry draft, and the comparisons of Kadri and Cowan has been an ongoing topic of discussion in various threads in these forums (go look for them if you wish) .

I simply pointed out that both now have the same number of goals at the NHL level, in relatively the same number of games.

Cowan is playing full-time in the NHL, while Kadri has been up and down and has yet to secure a full time job.

These are facts, and you may not like them, but they are true. How can this be interpreted as trolling?

Oh yeah, by the way, the leafs and Senators are rivals in the same division and Conference, and fans of each team tend to compare each others teams and players, if you want to twist that into someone trolling to evoke emotional distress on another fan, then perhaps you should stop visiting these types of forums.

here's an example of another thread, that compares a Hab with a leaf deal.
http://www.hockeybuzz.com...hp?thread_id=93216&page=1
Started by a leaf fan................so is he trolling???

based on your previous comments (Karlsson totally shut down OV- HES AWESOME!), we kinda do.
- Schenn-Sational!

In that one game, a couple of months ago, and it was originally pointed out by a leaf fan who had watched the game.
http://www.hockeybuzz.com...hp?thread_id=91413&page=2


October 19 @ 1:46 PM ET

Watched the most amazing thing the other night, the Senators put Karlsson out against Ovechken. All night Karllson stopped him at the blue line and took the puck away. The kid has incredible defensive one on one against elite talents. He has yet to learn to play solid positionally and let the play come to him he is so keen to go on the attack. You just have to let the kid play and all the defensive stuff will begin to fall into place, this is simply about time. The same thing will need to happen in regard to Rundblad. Cowen is a more traditional project and he will follow the same pattern of ups and downs for a shut down Dman.
- spatso

I simply agreed with him, as I also watched the game.

Wow, thin skinned and able to read my mind.

Once again, leaf fans have been perpetuating the myth that BB fleeced Murray at the 2009 entry draft, and the comparisons of Kadri and Cowan has been an ongoing topic of discussion in various threads in these forums (go look for them if you wish) .

I simply pointed out that both now have the same number of goals at the NHL level, in relatively the same number of games.

Cowan is playing full-time in the NHL, while Kadri has been up and down and has yet to secure a full time job.

These are facts, and you may not like them, but they are true. How can this be interpreted as trolling?

Oh yeah, by the way, the leafs and Senators are rivals in the same division and Conference, and fans of each team tend to compare each others teams and players, if you want to twist that into someone trolling to evoke emotional distress on another fan, then perhaps you should stop visiting these types of forums.

here's an example of another thread, that compares a Hab with a leaf deal.
http://www.hockeybuzz.com...hp?thread_id=93216&page=1
- Doppleganger

That's your idiotic take on what is being said. There is no way Burke "fleeced" Murray.... Because there was no need to. Burke had the higher pick. He had the option of taking whoever he wanted. Murray approached him to trade up, Burke asked him what player he wanted, and if it was Kadri, Murray replied yes, but that's who Burke wanted, so he took him.

It's that simple. There was no fleecing, because Burke already had the higher pick. No "fleecing" was required for Burke to get who he wanted. It was a bit of a comical exchange, Burke flippantly sending Murray away with his tail between his legs, but nothing more than that.

So stop it with your idiocy.

That's your idiotic take on what is being said. There is no way Burke "fleeced" Murray.... Because there was no need to. Burke had the higher pick. He had the option of taking whoever he wanted. Murray approached him to trade up, Burke asked him what player he wanted, and if it was Kadri, Murray replied yes, but that's who Burke wanted, so he took him.

It's that simple. There was no fleecing, because Burke already had the higher pick. No "fleecing" was required for Burke to get who he wanted. It was a bit of a comical exchange, Burke flippantly sending Murray away with his tail between his legs, but nothing more than that.

So stop it with your idiocy.
- prock

The "alleged" fleecing that some leaf fans (on this site) have posted, was that BB got Murray to show his hand, when Murray said he intended to select Kadri, if he was able to move up. Some leaf fans, want to believe that Murray really wanted Kadri and BB was able to deny Ottawa, by selecting him.

You know this to be true as you've read the posts.

The "alleged" fleecing that some leaf fans (on this site) have posted, was that BB got Murray to show his hand, when Murray said he intended to select Kadri, if he was able to move up. Some leaf fans, want to believe that Murray really wanted Kadri and BB was able to deny Ottawa, by selecting him.

You know this to be true as you've read the posts.
- Doppleganger

Actually, I do recall that, and if I recall correctly, those were sarcastic, IN RESPONSE to a Sens fans ridiculous suggestion that it was in fact Murray that was somehow duping Burke into taking Kadri......

In effect, it was an intentionally ridiculous suggestion, in response to more idiocy by you (or another Sens fan, I can't recall exactly).

Feel free to provide a link to it, if you like though. That would pretty quickly resolve this, wouldn't it?

Actually, I do recall that, and if I recall correctly, those were sarcastic, IN RESPONSE to a Sens fans ridiculous suggestion that it was in fact Murray that was somehow duping Burke into taking Kadri......

In effect, it was an intentionally ridiculous suggestion, in response to more idiocy by you (or another Sens fan, I can't recall exactly).

Feel free to provide a link to it, if you like though. That would pretty quickly resolve this, wouldn't it?
- prock

HA HA HA HA HA HA.........revisionist memory!!! It was a leaf fan who started the whole thing, and you know it.

Cowan > Kadri

Cowan > Kadri
- Doppleganger

i havent read the whole pissing match from the last 2 p ages but i must say thats very short sighted

i think both will go on to have very successful nhl careers but if cowen was on the leafs or a few other teams he probably would have started the year in the ahl

Wow, thin skinned and able to read my mind.

Once again, leaf fans have been perpetuating the myth that BB fleeced Murray at the 2009 entry draft, and the comparisons of Kadri and Cowan has been an ongoing topic of discussion in various threads in these forums (go look for them if you wish) .

I simply pointed out that both now have the same number of goals at the NHL level, in relatively the same number of games.

Cowan is playing full-time in the NHL, while Kadri has been up and down and has yet to secure a full time job.

These are facts, and you may not like them, but they are true. How can this be interpreted as trolling?

Oh yeah, by the way, the leafs and Senators are rivals in the same division and Conference, and fans of each team tend to compare each others teams and players, if you want to twist that into someone trolling to evoke emotional distress on another fan, then perhaps you should stop visiting these types of forums.

here's an example of another thread, that compares a Hab with a leaf deal.
http://www.hockeybuzz.com...hp?thread_id=93216&page=1
Started by a leaf fan................so is he trolling???
- Doppleganger

Did you read the first sentenc eof what I wrote and then just start typing yours? You addressed none of the points I made.. Not one.

LOL. He's got 6 points. Just 6. In over 30 games. That's really not very good. And he's obviously not exactly a rock defensively. No one is on that team, judging by the number of goals that get scored there.
- prock

Now 10 points and a +1 on the season. Since they started playing him on the top-pairing and letting him "get more into games":

9 GP 2G 6A 8P AVG TOI 25:20 +7 14 SOG

Overall Ottawa is -6 in those games. But yeah, for a 20-year-old rookie he's "really not very good."

did you also know that Karlsson leads all defenseman in the league in being on the ice for even strength goals against.

In fact, even if you count goals against while on the PK, only Duncan Keith has been on the ice for more goals against. But, you have to think that the fact that he plays over 26 minutes a night, with significant PK time, sort of contributes to that, wouldn't you?

Defensively, Erik Karlsson is one of the worst defenseman in the league. But keep referencing those points. While he keeps costing the Sens games because he can't play D.
- prock

How is Karlsson "costing" the Sens games when they weren't even supposed to win 10 this season? Yeah, Karlsson's inadequacy is what's dragging the otherwise powerhouse Senators down. Probably one of the dumbest statements I've seen here in a while. But then it makes the trolling obvious.

Incidentally Karlsson is on the ice for more goals for than any player in the league apart from Keith, who plays on a team that averages .22 more goals per game and has been on the ice for 1 more goal than Karlsson.

In re goals against: Karlsson is a 21-year-old defenceman who regardless of partner is matching up against the top forwards of the other team. Keith plays about 40 seconds more per game and a little over a minute more on the PK. Cry me a river. Karlsson's also not playing in front of elite goaltenders (although neither is Keith).

Karlsson is a top-3 offensive defenceman in the league at an incredibly young age. His defence is not #1 defenceman calibre at this point but it has improved markedly each season. It would be a different matter if he were putting up those defensive stats playing 15-17 minutes a game against third and fourth lines.

But whatever. Keep pretending you wouldn't bend over backwards to have a talent like Karlsson on the Leafs' blue-line.

Particularly true for D.

And Erik Karlsson is, quite legitimately, one of the worst defenders in the NHL. He's useless in his own zone.
- prock

So useless that he's first in the league in take-aways for a defenceman.

Now 10 points and a +1 on the season. Since they started playing him on the top-pairing and letting him "get more into games":

9 GP 2G 6A 8P AVG TOI 25:20 +7 14 SOG

Overall Ottawa is -6 in those games. But yeah, for a 20-year-old rookie he's "really not very good."





How is Karlsson "costing" the Sens games when they weren't even supposed to win 10 this season? Yeah, Karlsson's inadequacy is what's dragging the otherwise powerhouse Senators down. Probably one of the dumbest statements I've seen here in a while. But then it makes the trolling obvious.

Incidentally Karlsson is on the ice for more goals for than any player in the league apart from Keith, who plays on a team that averages .22 more goals per game and has been on the ice for 1 more goal than Karlsson.

In re goals against: Karlsson is a 21-year-old defenceman who regardless of partner is matching up against the top forwards of the other team. Keith plays about 40 seconds more per game and a little over a minute more on the PK. Cry me a river. Karlsson's also not playing in front of elite goaltenders (although neither is Keith).

Karlsson is a top-3 offensive defenceman in the league at an incredibly young age. His defence is not #1 defenceman calibre at this point but it has improved markedly each season. It would be a different matter if he were putting up those defensive stats playing 15-17 minutes a game against third and fourth lines.

But whatever. Keep pretending you wouldn't bend over backwards to have a talent like Karlsson on the Leafs' blue-line.



So useless that he's first in the league in take-aways for a defenceman.
- Asquaredx2

Erik Karlsson Take-Aways: 28
Erik Karlsson Give-Aways: 31

He's good enough to do it. But he's injured.

Do you think the Sens will be 3 points back of the Leafs after tonight, or 5?
- prock

Hey prock, I can't access NHL.com for some reason. How far ahead are the Leafs now?

Hey prock, I can't access NHL.com for some reason. How far ahead are the Leafs now?
- Asquaredx2

Shows you how important a coach is.

Following trends though, Leafs will start their late season push soon.

Shows you how important a coach is.

Following trends though, Leafs will start their late season push soon.
- Schenn-Sational!

I suspect you're right. I can see the leafs, Jets and Capitals pushing to fill the 7th and 8th spots in the Eastern Conference

I suspect you're right. I can see the leafs, Jets and Capitals pushing to fill the 7th and 8th spots in the Eastern Conference
- Doppleganger

and the sens?

and the sens?
- Schenn-Sational!

I still think they miss ,but they should be close.Still a far cry from dead last like many expected.I said from the begining that ottawa, montreal and toronto are all in the same boat all decent but nothing special teams

and the sens?
- Schenn-Sational!

Just as I said since the beginning of the season. Not last in the Conference, but not playoff bound either.

September 6 @ 12:29 AM ET

I see the other three teams in the Division being that much better than the two from Ontario. It does not mean they''l be worse than last year, it just they haven't improved as much as the other teams have. I don't see either the leafs or the Senators being in serious contention for playoff spots.
- Doppleganger

I still think they miss ,but they should be close.Still a far cry from dead last like many expected.I said from the begining that ottawa, montreal and toronto are all in the same boat all decent but nothing special teams
- top shelf 15

Preseason, I definitely saw Ottawa duking it out with the Isles for last. Once I saw coach stache's system, I knew theyd be trouble for the Leafs... Wouldn't be surprised if we lost the rest of the series to you guys(barring big trades)

Leads are where I expected. Fighting for the playoffs. Still think this is the year they make it.

Just as I said since the beginning of the season. Not last in the Conference, but not playoff bound either.

September 6 @ 12:29 AM ET
- Doppleganger

Ok.

But barring trades, I think they'll be in the mix.

It's absolutely amazing how he interprets stats. Anyone can do the same. For instance:

Toronto:

- has the leading scorer in the league
- We have a defence with the 2nd highest +/- out of all defencemen, and he also happens to be tied for 4th overall for the most points by a defenceman
- Reimer is one of only 2 goalies in the league that has played 5 or more games and still doesn't have a regulation loss

Whereas Ottawa:

- Has a forward (Greening) with the 5th worst +/- in the league for forwards
- Anderson has the 2nd worst save % of any goalie that has played more than 5 games

It is very easy to try and make stats represent whatever your point is when you leave key pieces off the table.

Stop trying Dopple, your arguments are terrible, and most people don't take them seriously for that reason
- mfreedman

Perhaps my arguments were NOT as terrible as you suggested (last Nov) and perhaps you were just as guilty of what you accused me of (to try and make stats represent whatever your point is when you leave key pieces off the table.)

Perhaps my arguments were NOT as terrible as you suggested (last Nov) and perhaps you were just as guilty of what you accused me of (to try and make stats represent whatever your point is when you leave key pieces off the table.)
- Doppleganger

is there a thread where you dont argue with 98% of the other posters?

is there a thread where you dont argue with 98% of the other posters?
- the_cause2000

If there a thread you don't troll, looking for my posts from the distant past, and replying to them? I must be a big part of your day.

If there a thread you don't troll, looking for my posts from the distant past, and replying to them? I must be a big part of your day.
- Doppleganger

the biggest

the biggest
- the_cause2000

That is just so sad.